By UPDATE #4: The Korea Herald has now gotten in on the anti-USFK bandwagon:
The South Korean government is granted primary jurisdiction in crimes committed by U.S. soldiers outside working hours as outlined by the Status of Forces Agreement that governs the legal status of U.S. troops and their dependants here.
However, many U.S. soldiers have evaded the South Korean jurisdiction by citing their exemption from the SOFA clause by claiming on-duty status.
Once again a major Korean news media outlet blatantly passing disinformation. Here is something I am wondering? Chosun Ilbo why haven’t you gotten into the anti-USFK hate fest yet? Do you actually have journalistic standards unlike the rest of the Korean news media? It is still early I guess we will see.
Also, I highly recommend you read this post, this post, and definitely this post from the Korea Sojourner if really want to know how the Korean news media operates.
__________________________________________________________
UPDATE #3: Now this is my favorite headline, from the Donga: A series of crimes committed by U.S. soldiers and their children threaten Seoul and Gyeonggi Province. They might as well and ran this headline: Run for Your Lives the Americans are Sacking Seoul and the Rest of Gyeongi Province. Here are the alledged details from the taxi cab incident the article provides:
According to the police, the private and other soldiers jumped onto a taxi that was waiting for a green signal at a crosswalk and acted violently on the night of July 15 in Uijeongbu city. They assaulted the taxi driver who tried to stop them, and attacked two other citizens who also tried to hold them back.
Some how I doubt the soldiers just jumped into the taxi and started beating the driver. There is more to this story but we will probably never hear it.
_________________________________________________________
UPDATE #2: I just read the Korea Times article on this incident and all I can say is unbelievable. How are these people considered journalists? Check out this quote from the article:
About 40 South Korean civic activists staged a rally in front of the headquarters of the U.S. 2nd Infantry Division in Tongduchon, northern Kyonggi Province, claiming that the three U.S. soldiers involved in the assaults should be arrested and compensation be paid.
Under the Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA) that stipulates the legal status of U.S. troops and their dependents here, the Korean government is allowed to have primary jurisdiction in crimes committed by U.S. soldiers outside of working hours.
However, many U.S. soldiers have avoided the South Korean jurisdiction by claiming that they engaged in criminal acts while on duty.
First of all the 2ID headquarters is in Uijongbu and the protest happened in Uijongbu not Dongducheon because they shut down the front gate at CRC for a little this weekend in response to it. Secondly, once again I challenge anyone of these so called journalists to provide an example on when a soldier that was clearly off duty that committed a criminal act was able to avoid prosecution by claiming they were on duty. This out right disinformation used to stereotype the soldiers in USFK. The state of the Korean news media is really sickening.
____________________________________________________________
UPDATE #1: Yonhap has further expanded on their article. Check out this last paragraph they added to the article:
The South Korean government is granted primary jurisdiction in crimes committed by U.S. soldiers outside of working hours as outlined by the Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA) that governs
the legal status of U.S. troops and their dependents here. However, many U.S. soldiers have evaded the South Korean jurisdiction by citing their exemption from the SOFA clause by claiming on-duty status.
Can anyone name a case where the soldier was off duty and was granted SOFA status anyway? I have never heard of one so I’m not sure how Yonhap can say, I quote: “many US soldiers” are evading South Korean jurisdiction. This is an out right lie.
Plus it is ironic that Yonhap complains about the SOFA but the ROK Army has a similar SOFA agreement in place for the Zaytun unit in Iraq. A ROK soldier kills a local Kurdish Peshmerga soldier and they didn’t turn him over to the Kurdish authorities because they cited he was on duty.
I continue to push my arguement that is a drunken fight with a taxi driver more newsworthy than the rape and robbery of a US soldier? It appears the Korean media and law enforcement authorities are more concerned about arresting these drunk GI’s, than the rapist that is running around Korea right now.
____________________________________________________________
Police are investigating a son of a U.S. soldier for allegedly throwing a glass liquor bottle at a passing bus in Seoul and destroying the bus’s front windscreen, police said Sunday.
“One of six drunken U.S. teenagers belonging to the U.S. base in Yongsan (in downtown Seoul) threw a bottle from the roadside on Saturday night,” the police said.
I think it may be time to lock down Yongsan. (Yes I’m being sarcastic.)
9:38 am on January 7th, 2007 1
Well, anything north of Suwon is "2 ID" to me.
Lock 'em down and throw away the key, I say. No booze, period, and daily mandatory church services for all. Catholic mass, at that. And if they do go off post, they must wear dress slacks and button down shirts (ties are optional).
9:41 am on January 7th, 2007 2
So what if some kids wanted to have some fun? Like all the other cases, it's all Koreans fault anyway.
9:47 am on January 7th, 2007 3
I just finished emailing a letter to the Korea Times editor. I posted it on my blog with the addess I gave with this comment.
You will see GI Korea and I had the same initial thought.
That article was a classic example of the norm for the Korean media when it comes to the US and US military in Korea.
But what can we expect. It was after aDUI accident, a fatality, not too aweful long ago that the editor of the Times wrote in an opinion piece that it was "the first time" Korea was going to get to put a GI on trial. Unfucking believable.
There is a brain block when it comes to what Koreans really do know about how GI crimes are handled and what they have convinced themselves they know.
My adult students (age 20-60) would frequently justify the claim that US soliders "never" face Korean justice but just fly away home — by telling me examples of horrible GI crimes, but when I got to asking for details, they would show they knew the GIs were arrested and stood trial in a Korean court. They knew the soldiers had been found guilty, but somehow it did not stick in their brain.
9:47 am on January 7th, 2007 4
Yes. Yes. This is the usual Korean hop skip and jump. It makes sense to yall somehow.
Pointing out a blantant misrepresentation in the news media about the general outcome when US soldiers are accused of crimes is called by you an effort to blame Korea for everthing.
Perfect logic…..
9:48 am on January 7th, 2007 5
The president Roh is preparing a pardon for the criminals as many of 6.75 millions. Why you guys are not requesting to include those poor American teen-agers' case in the pardon?
Although I have no voting right in the South Korea, I'm ready to recommend the South Koreans to change the president Roh's term of office to his life long. He is the most great emperor in their 5,000 years long history. If he gets a life long term of office, surely he can launch up the South Korea to higher levels by 2010…. to Mars?
By the way, 6.75 millions of criminals! Wikipedia tells me the population of this country is about 46 millions. It comes about 15% of the population are criminals…. Did I get something wrong?
9:49 am on January 7th, 2007 6
Heres athought. The soldiers obivously have to much time on their hands. So, from now on, have alerts with load outs 2-3 times a month. Next stay in the field, up to 30 days till someone in the ville realizes, if we dont work with the GI's we'll be out of business, or just put the whole ville off limits till the business's get their act together, including the cabbies. Thats what happend to us at CP Stanley. Then, have one more alert and move them all back to Ft Lewis or Iraq! With only a minor command team in Yongsan and never to return to Korea!
9:51 am on January 7th, 2007 7
I don't know, because I haven't followed the issue at all, but a wild guess could be that postumous pardons for dead Koreans and for those already out of jail are included. This happens in the US too. Families, and sometimes descendants, want to clear the name of their forefather who they believe was unjustly found guilty. So, the president will include them in any amnesty deal if he believes they are telling the truth or that a wrong needs to be corrected.
10:05 am on January 7th, 2007 8
If it means anything to you, the Korean headline to the Dong-A piece was:
ìˆ ì·¨í•œ 주한미군 ìžë…€ 6명 달리는 ë²„ìŠ¤ì— ìˆ ë³‘ ë˜ì ¸
i.e., "Six drunk kids of USFK members throw booze bottle at moving bus."
A lot less provocative than the English title. This is not to say that the Korean press doesn't run its fair share of inflamatory headlines, but you can't go by the English ones, because they are often very different from the original Korean ones.
10:15 am on January 7th, 2007 9
GI Korea can gripe about the Korean press, but he's missing the point. I was stationed in Korea for 38 months. I get frustrated when I think about the way that US servicemembers and their dependents behave in Korea. If you spend any time in Yongsan or Itaewon, you can see Americans doing stupid, embarrassing things that they would never do at home. Consider, for example, Hannam Village. The families that are housed in Hannam Village are what would be identified as low- to mid-income families back in the US. The US government, instead of keeping them confined to Yongsan proper — either South Post, Main Post, or Camp Coiner — has stuck them out in the middle of Hannam-dong. These families have, in Korea, the same social issues that families of their standing typically have in the US: low income, inadequate supervision of children, single parents, young parents, etc. If you go to Popeyes or Burger King on Yongsan, for lunch, you can see that the kids at SAHS are generally a bunch of hooligans — kids of enlisted SMs and field grade officers alike. Have you ever heard these high school students talk about going to Gheko's or the King Club? I have. How could that be? Isn't it disgusting? If there were a couple hundred Korean teenagers running around a small area within a major metropolitan area in the US, our press might take issue with it, also. Also on the topic of Itaewon, look at the way that all of the brothers, boot scooters, and metal heads act. Check out the King Club, UN Club, Kettle House, or Grand Ole Opry. You can go in the King Club and see US soldiers (male on female) simulating anal sex on the floor of the club. Same in the UN Club. Fights break out repeatedly in the Kettle House and then bleed over into the Grand Ole Opry. It's sick, and none of it is how people are allowed to act in the US. Anyway, there's more that I'd like to say, but I have to go to work. GI Korea, use your forum to address American behavior before you criticize the Korean press for reacting to it. Peace.
10:16 am on January 7th, 2007 10
Once again I don't blame the Korean press for the soldier's behavior. I have already stated repeatedly that the soldiers arrested are idiots and will be prosecuted and dealt with as usual. What I am saying is that the Korean press is spreading disinformation about the SOFA agreement. I have sent emails to the concerned Korean news organizations asking them to provide one example of a soldier evading responsibility for an obvious off duty crime by claiming to be on duty. No one has answered back.
Plus in a way you are agreeing with me that conditions are what cause the problems here. You talk about Hannam village being outside of the Yongsan perimeter. If the families were not housed outside of post there would be less incidents with the surrounding population. In fact if they finally more the entire post of Yongsan like they have been talking about for years but the Korean government continues to delay that would really reduce incidents.
The actions of people you see in the clubs is things you see in the clubs in the US. The simulated anal sex you talk about is called grinding and is often done in clubs in the US. Then fights breaking out in the club happens all the time in the US. I used to be a bouncer at a country bar in Arizona. I saw plenty of scraps there. So this is not behavior unique to Korea.
Behavior by soldiers that is unique to Korea is the amount of underage drinking and problems with prostitution. That is why I have been advocating putting the ville off limits to underage drinkers and clubs with female foreign nationals off limits.
At no point have I advocated that the soldiers involved in incidents should get over. They need to be given a fair trial and then properly punished. The key point of my post is to expose the misinformation passed by the Korean media in an effort to further anti-American sentiment.
10:19 am on January 7th, 2007 11
You hear this a lot, but is it really the case.
Korea teens out in the street in packs doesn't happen in LA's Korea Town or the one in NY or SF?
Those Korean teens in the US that hangout together and go cruising and such don't do what a lot of US teens do? underaged drinking, occasional fights, drug use, some more major criminal activity?
And the US press would likely cover it if it did?
The Korean prostitution bust across the nation was national news. What other examples come to mind? I can remember Korean gangs shooting it out in NY in the late 1980s? But regular exposes on what Korean teens are doing bad in LA's Korea down making it to the Washington Times and the NY Times front page? No….
Next, on the issue of "none of it is how people are allowed to act in the US" — I can agree up to a limited point. Why? Because I've been around a lot of college campuses in the US and in bars and clubs that cater to young, hormone driven, usually middle class and above, kids of all stripes.
We might get into a useful discussion about percentages of bad acts….
but, drunking to excess regularly, fist fights breaking out not being a shocker, seeking for females like sharks to a feeding frenzy, vandalism, and so on and so on, not being a regular part of the night life scene in the US?
What about spring break for high school and college students?
Marti Gras?
Come on….
And I do think I have enough experience to say this about Korea. I am not an "its all relative." Differences in degree can be significant. And I went to enough Korean only night spots for college kids and those for slightly older to believe I noticed a difference.
I didn't see any confrontations in the Korean clubs that led to punches or beyond staring angrily at each other. I'm sure they happen, but in the US college clubs, especially for 1st and 2nd year students, a fight was no shock. Maybe it didn't happen every time I went to a club, but it wasn't a shock to see one.
But everything else I saw in the Korean spots for young adults was similar enough to what I saw in the US. I'm smiling as I type this because I'm remembering a guy doing a dance with this girl as part of some competition, and he was turned around kind of funny, and when he turned back and started bumping and grinding, he had taken his arm through his sleeve and ran it down his stomach to push his loose pants out like his dick was 3 feet long. Everybody died laughing…
And I was almost always the only white (non-Korean) in these places most of the time.
And I remember the guys and girls I was with feeling like me in one club's we bar hopped to in Kangnam was somewhere we needed to exit fast — because it looked rough.
And the last time I was in Korea for a significant period of time, I had to catch a cross country train every morning, and I had to get a taxi in an entertainment (nice and clean) part of a city in Kangwon provice at around 4:30 or 5:00 AM. And EVERY morning, with the exception of early Mondays, I would see Korean men and women in their late 20s to mid-30s and some up to the 40s, walking in the streets to catch taxi rides home or eat at an all night hot noodle restaurant. They often had on suits and dresses and seemed to live the "work hard/play hard" philosophy in Korea. I also used the PC bang in this area late at night, and in these times on the street, I saw men hoot at women and chase after them, and saw women who liked and a few times where the man went too far and they didn't like it —- to the point where I actually saw a couple of other Korean men move to jump in on one occasions.
And in my first 1 1/2 to 2 years in Korea, I lived above an old market where a lot of small, dirty restaurants and drinking places, and some prostitution places, were frequented by Koreans aged 40 and up. And since I'm a light sleeper, I would be woken up — at minimum — 3 times a week. It was hell with a hakwon teaching schedule, but my boss wouldn't relocate me. There were many nights I'd just say "fuck it" and pull up a chair to my 4th floor window and open it and stare out like I was watching late night tv — and it was just as interesting. I only wish I could have understood Korean fluently.
I watched many drunken, joyous street singings and stopping for a few last shots at the plastic soju tent in front of my apartment building, and I saw an equal number of drunken confrontations. I will say this about them — the Korean men don't go to using fists like we do in the US. They are more likely to push and pull on each other and scream and then walk away, or if they know each other, end up in a drunken hug to go off for more alcohol and women. And another difference I noticed is that Korean middle aged women are more likely to start throwing punches than both Korean men and American women. I saw this routinely on the weekends at E-Mart.
The worst I saw out my window was a father so drunk while he was arguing with his friend to keep drinking when the friend was trying to walk away, he eventually feel half-passed out on the ground and couldn't be gotten up, though he tried, —– and his 8 to 11 year old daughter was screaming and crying, and the friend was trying to take her away and leave the father, but the girl kept grabbing his coat.
Meanwhile, the cops in the little shack they put up at the front of my apartment building because some pissed off cheated boyfriend had gotten in a fight that broke the apartment's glass doors open and then the next night smashed the new guy's car windows open —– just stood by and watched the drunk father and little girl and did nothing.
The Canadian I worked with (who was the only other foreigner in my school) said he almost went down there to either punch out a cop or a Korean woman at 3 AM one time because the middle aged woman had a baby tied to her back, but she was screaming at her man while the drunken friends watched, and even when the police called in a squad car, she kept jumping around and slapping her husband and even slapped the young officer — to which he just walked to the other end of the car and skulked while the older officer did nothing.
But, in Korea, poeple don't act like that nor do they act like that in the US…..
It's the soldiers and camp town kids who are abnormal to a high degree….
I understand the temptation to make conclusions like, "They'd never do that in the US!" I do it too. but, I try to catch myself at it and think back to what I've really seen in my life….