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	<title>Comments on: The Off Limits Game</title>
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	<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/</link>
	<description>Serving on the Forgotten Frontier</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 20:09:41 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: john</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-187884</link>
		<dc:creator>john</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Aug 2008 10:17:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-187884</guid>
		<description>The only Koreans in the bars are disfunctional, either they have drug habits or mental problems or need to feed their kid(s) because they are a single mother.  Koreans are deep in the pride dept and if MOM knew her daughter was a juciy, she kick the shit out of her.  Korea society has come a long way in the past 50 years if you havent noticed.  Korea is trying to break in 1st world nation status and could do it if they stopped stepping on their D!@#.

Korean jucies are gone for the most part.  Korean girls who want an American will just work on base/post as its more respectable.  The only part of Korea that stinks is the Ville or the fish market.  Korea is safer than any major US city but its backwards in many ways.

The military should just sponsor trips to Thai as they are in the development stage as Korea was 30 years ago.  The ville needs to be leveled as all you get is an empty wallet and headaches.  

Military guys want a real Korean g/f.  Step one stop acting like a bunch of jackasses all the time.  Step two try using manners.  Step three try going to a college area or a place where shitbums dont work.  Now wasnt that easy...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The only Koreans in the bars are disfunctional, either they have drug habits or mental problems or need to feed their kid(s) because they are a single mother.  Koreans are deep in the pride dept and if MOM knew her daughter was a juciy, she kick the shit out of her.  Korea society has come a long way in the past 50 years if you havent noticed.  Korea is trying to break in 1st world nation status and could do it if they stopped stepping on their D!@#.</p>
<p>Korean jucies are gone for the most part.  Korean girls who want an American will just work on base/post as its more respectable.  The only part of Korea that stinks is the Ville or the fish market.  Korea is safer than any major US city but its backwards in many ways.</p>
<p>The military should just sponsor trips to Thai as they are in the development stage as Korea was 30 years ago.  The ville needs to be leveled as all you get is an empty wallet and headaches.  </p>
<p>Military guys want a real Korean g/f.  Step one stop acting like a bunch of jackasses all the time.  Step two try using manners.  Step three try going to a college area or a place where shitbums dont work.  Now wasnt that easy&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: April</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-187718</link>
		<dc:creator>April</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Aug 2008 04:37:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-187718</guid>
		<description>Some quick points for Tom and Richard.

Often it DOES smell bad here. It smells like rotting fish and kimchi and soju. There are places in the US that smell bad too...we lived in Ft. Stewart, GA for 3 years and it smelled really bad there too. Some things are just facts and not insults to the Korean people.

I have never called anyone or heard anyone called Mamasan or Papasan. I hear the terms ajushi and ajuma (sorry if spelled wrong) all of the time, even from the most ignorant of US soldiers who speak such improper English it makes me cringe. 

All of the KATUSAs we know express such gratitude for being a KATUSA instead of a ROK Army soldier.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some quick points for Tom and Richard.</p>
<p>Often it DOES smell bad here. It smells like rotting fish and kimchi and soju. There are places in the US that smell bad too&#8230;we lived in Ft. Stewart, GA for 3 years and it smelled really bad there too. Some things are just facts and not insults to the Korean people.</p>
<p>I have never called anyone or heard anyone called Mamasan or Papasan. I hear the terms ajushi and ajuma (sorry if spelled wrong) all of the time, even from the most ignorant of US soldiers who speak such improper English it makes me cringe. </p>
<p>All of the KATUSAs we know express such gratitude for being a KATUSA instead of a ROK Army soldier.</p>
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		<title>By: April</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-187709</link>
		<dc:creator>April</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Aug 2008 04:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-187709</guid>
		<description>Tom: "Any reason why the number of Filipino and Russian girls have increased, gradually replacing the Korean girls in those camp towns over these years?"

Yes. They are cheaper. 

I don't know what happened to you to make you so hateful and bitter. I am guessing it is possible you are NOT a former KATUSA and are actually a troll.

My husband works with KATUSAs. We have had some in our home as guests and they talk with us and play with our children. They seek us out and offer to show us the great sites of Korea.

They all say how much they appreciate the US Army and are ashamed of anti-American sentiment in Korea.

Yes, there are some young, dumb, agressive soldiers. I think a lot of this type join the Army because they are already bullies and think the Army will give them a good outlet for that. We all see them. But they are the exception, not the rule. 

And if the soldiers were given the opportunity to do something other than drink and pay for the company of a woman, I believe a lot of them would.

MWR, which is fully funded, charges ridiculous "transportation" prices for the trips, which SHOULD be FREE, at least for the soldiers. The fees for family members should be a lot cheaper. If these opportunities were paid for with the funds provided to MWR instead of it being another racket to take money from soldiers, I think soldiers would do things that are more worthwhile. (this would also require the elimination of the curfew).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom: &#8220;Any reason why the number of Filipino and Russian girls have increased, gradually replacing the Korean girls in those camp towns over these years?&#8221;</p>
<p>Yes. They are cheaper. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know what happened to you to make you so hateful and bitter. I am guessing it is possible you are NOT a former KATUSA and are actually a troll.</p>
<p>My husband works with KATUSAs. We have had some in our home as guests and they talk with us and play with our children. They seek us out and offer to show us the great sites of Korea.</p>
<p>They all say how much they appreciate the US Army and are ashamed of anti-American sentiment in Korea.</p>
<p>Yes, there are some young, dumb, agressive soldiers. I think a lot of this type join the Army because they are already bullies and think the Army will give them a good outlet for that. We all see them. But they are the exception, not the rule. </p>
<p>And if the soldiers were given the opportunity to do something other than drink and pay for the company of a woman, I believe a lot of them would.</p>
<p>MWR, which is fully funded, charges ridiculous &#8220;transportation&#8221; prices for the trips, which SHOULD be FREE, at least for the soldiers. The fees for family members should be a lot cheaper. If these opportunities were paid for with the funds provided to MWR instead of it being another racket to take money from soldiers, I think soldiers would do things that are more worthwhile. (this would also require the elimination of the curfew).</p>
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		<title>By: Drunk Gilrs College</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-151513</link>
		<dc:creator>Drunk Gilrs College</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Apr 2008 17:08:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-151513</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] The Off Limits Game The YTN report complains about drunk foreigners whistling and making comments at to places not called "The Ville", went to Korean Bars with College Students. [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://dev.wp-plugins.org/wiki/Kramer" target="_blank"><img src="http://rokdrop.com/wp-content/plugins/kramer/kramer.php?kramer=gif-icon" class="technorati-balloon" alt="Kramer auto Pingback" style="border:0;" /></a>[...] The Off Limits Game The YTN report complains about drunk foreigners whistling and making comments at to places not called &#8220;The Ville&#8221;, went to Korean Bars with College Students. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: 2007 ROK Drop Year in Review at ROK Drop</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-113677</link>
		<dc:creator>2007 ROK Drop Year in Review at ROK Drop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Dec 2007 16:10:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-113677</guid>
		<description>[...] - February - Hongdae area of Seoul put off limits to American GIs by USFK [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] - February - Hongdae area of Seoul put off limits to American GIs by USFK [...]</p>
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		<title>By: GI Korea</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-8378</link>
		<dc:creator>GI Korea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Mar 2007 06:24:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-8378</guid>
		<description>view from the former Katusa,

That commander should have court martialed that E5 for what he did.  It was a good thing that he was relieved of command.  Also if you see someone selling crack you should notify someone in the command.  A surprise health and welfare inspection could catch this guy.  

I hope you keep reading the blog and provide more insightful comments from a Korean perspective.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>view from the former Katusa,</p>
<p>That commander should have court martialed that E5 for what he did.  It was a good thing that he was relieved of command.  Also if you see someone selling crack you should notify someone in the command.  A surprise health and welfare inspection could catch this guy.  </p>
<p>I hope you keep reading the blog and provide more insightful comments from a Korean perspective.</p>
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		<title>By: US Army, view from the former Katusa</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-8376</link>
		<dc:creator>US Army, view from the former Katusa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Mar 2007 06:03:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-8376</guid>
		<description>I served in camp casey from 99 to 01.
And I remember there were some fine soldiers in US Army, like my battalion command sergeant major whose work ethic was so imprresively ingrained in my memory until now, no personal time but taking care of the soldiers 24/7,
(sounds somewhat like korean,eh?)
also some patriotic and bright officers pursuing their careers with great ambition. 
However, there were some people who I wondered how they even become a part of US Army to serve their nation, and even dispatched to other countries. Once there was this sergeant E-5, in our support platoon who got caught stealing GPS devices and sell them in the black market in TDC. Our poor CO at that time forgave him and didn't punish him through UCMJ. And later this sergeant got grumpy with his CO for some other issues and informed the  Division Inspector General of his wrongdoing. The CO got fired from his job and this E-5 got involuntary discharge. It was a really embarassing moment even to me. Also there was another E-5 who supplied the cracks into the base, and selling to his soldiers. Fortunately he wasn't caught until I leave camp casey. 

So, my conclusion is that there is a wide spectrum in the US Army.
And usually the bottom of this spectrum are easily caught in the eye of Korean, because they are not so common in the so homogenous society like Korea.
I am not denying that the media usually hyperbolize some rare occurence.
Most GIs that I remember were fine young men.

But these rare occurences are so gruesome, like poking umbrella in the woman's genital or raping a very old lady, they often leave a strong impression that lasts long.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I served in camp casey from 99 to 01.<br />
And I remember there were some fine soldiers in US Army, like my battalion command sergeant major whose work ethic was so imprresively ingrained in my memory until now, no personal time but taking care of the soldiers 24/7,<br />
(sounds somewhat like korean,eh?)<br />
also some patriotic and bright officers pursuing their careers with great ambition.<br />
However, there were some people who I wondered how they even become a part of US Army to serve their nation, and even dispatched to other countries. Once there was this sergeant E-5, in our support platoon who got caught stealing GPS devices and sell them in the black market in TDC. Our poor CO at that time forgave him and didn&#8217;t punish him through UCMJ. And later this sergeant got grumpy with his CO for some other issues and informed the  Division Inspector General of his wrongdoing. The CO got fired from his job and this E-5 got involuntary discharge. It was a really embarassing moment even to me. Also there was another E-5 who supplied the cracks into the base, and selling to his soldiers. Fortunately he wasn&#8217;t caught until I leave camp casey. </p>
<p>So, my conclusion is that there is a wide spectrum in the US Army.<br />
And usually the bottom of this spectrum are easily caught in the eye of Korean, because they are not so common in the so homogenous society like Korea.<br />
I am not denying that the media usually hyperbolize some rare occurence.<br />
Most GIs that I remember were fine young men.</p>
<p>But these rare occurences are so gruesome, like poking umbrella in the woman&#8217;s genital or raping a very old lady, they often leave a strong impression that lasts long.</p>
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		<title>By: Sergeant Sellout</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-6981</link>
		<dc:creator>Sergeant Sellout</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Feb 2007 15:31:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-6981</guid>
		<description>I can touch on a few facts -

Koreans are culturally different in many ways (cat calling, public drunkeness) but very similar in many things... politics will dictate what is said and how it is spun in the media.

Reruiting, being made to do it, kicking and screaming the whole way, and thankful to be done I have to say "Recruiters are a bunch of liers". So is the chain of command out in USAREC, for the majority with no exageration I could only trust about 5 recruiters out of a whole battalion of recruiters. 

Many reasons that people stay out on recruiting is because the command has some supressed charge held over their head, so they are stressed, over weight, and pending UCMJ, but if they will sign the 4187 to extend to be a permanent recruiter, one of those problems seems to just disappear, not the weight or stress. Recruiters don't supress charges, what they do is recruit people in areas that do not release police records and pray that the person does not have a FBI fingerprint record which most check to Cover their "fouth point of contact". Some recruiters were printing High school diplomas off of their printers in their office. This is not too long ago in 2000. They have students take the ASVAB for other applicants to get them in the service with a passing score. They make sure their is no meantion of Juvinille charges and that includes "sex crimes" so how would anyone in the command know that a sick sexual predator was lurking in their ranks... they wouldnt until Hondae. Their is so much pressure put on recruiters even the best ones cave. I was fortunate that I had figured out my market and was working 14-15 hours a day which eventually paid off, with some prayer. I knew a couple recuiters that would spend their time to educate some students who could not pass the ASVAB so that they could legally enter the service. By the way this was discouraged by the command as was anything that was successful. I seen civilian recruiters taking and giving bribes for contracts in excess of 1000$(which is illegal) I blog for hours about how corrupt the recruiting system is. Many of the good (having values and not compromising) recruiters have rejoined the Army again and left recruiting, also many were put out of the Army for not meeting mission, over weight and finally comming to conflict with the corrupt leadership. If you notice the Army is paying 2,000$ for a referal bonus to any service member that can find someone to join. Someone could stand to make 8,000$ a month is they could meed the numbers I was required too(4 persons)it is obtainable but note that you have to beg borrow and be willing to steal to find 4 a month. 

I have had numerous tours in Korea, but it feels like each is a different assignment. 

Back to the "off limits" leaders can do what they want because the soldiers causing the trouble are going to continue to break rules already in place. I just would like to summize that every commander should have 1 year out on recuiting. The way they treat their soldiers would reflect their experience there. I am not saying baby them or be to hard, just I feel they would have a better understanding of what is takes to keep someone that the Army has spent close to 30,000 each on(more with marketing) before making their UCMJ and policy decisions. Not saying be harder or softer, just more informed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can touch on a few facts -</p>
<p>Koreans are culturally different in many ways (cat calling, public drunkeness) but very similar in many things&#8230; politics will dictate what is said and how it is spun in the media.</p>
<p>Reruiting, being made to do it, kicking and screaming the whole way, and thankful to be done I have to say &#8220;Recruiters are a bunch of liers&#8221;. So is the chain of command out in USAREC, for the majority with no exageration I could only trust about 5 recruiters out of a whole battalion of recruiters. </p>
<p>Many reasons that people stay out on recruiting is because the command has some supressed charge held over their head, so they are stressed, over weight, and pending UCMJ, but if they will sign the 4187 to extend to be a permanent recruiter, one of those problems seems to just disappear, not the weight or stress. Recruiters don&#8217;t supress charges, what they do is recruit people in areas that do not release police records and pray that the person does not have a FBI fingerprint record which most check to Cover their &#8220;fouth point of contact&#8221;. Some recruiters were printing High school diplomas off of their printers in their office. This is not too long ago in 2000. They have students take the ASVAB for other applicants to get them in the service with a passing score. They make sure their is no meantion of Juvinille charges and that includes &#8220;sex crimes&#8221; so how would anyone in the command know that a sick sexual predator was lurking in their ranks&#8230; they wouldnt until Hondae. Their is so much pressure put on recruiters even the best ones cave. I was fortunate that I had figured out my market and was working 14-15 hours a day which eventually paid off, with some prayer. I knew a couple recuiters that would spend their time to educate some students who could not pass the ASVAB so that they could legally enter the service. By the way this was discouraged by the command as was anything that was successful. I seen civilian recruiters taking and giving bribes for contracts in excess of 1000$(which is illegal) I blog for hours about how corrupt the recruiting system is. Many of the good (having values and not compromising) recruiters have rejoined the Army again and left recruiting, also many were put out of the Army for not meeting mission, over weight and finally comming to conflict with the corrupt leadership. If you notice the Army is paying 2,000$ for a referal bonus to any service member that can find someone to join. Someone could stand to make 8,000$ a month is they could meed the numbers I was required too(4 persons)it is obtainable but note that you have to beg borrow and be willing to steal to find 4 a month. </p>
<p>I have had numerous tours in Korea, but it feels like each is a different assignment. </p>
<p>Back to the &#8220;off limits&#8221; leaders can do what they want because the soldiers causing the trouble are going to continue to break rules already in place. I just would like to summize that every commander should have 1 year out on recuiting. The way they treat their soldiers would reflect their experience there. I am not saying baby them or be to hard, just I feel they would have a better understanding of what is takes to keep someone that the Army has spent close to 30,000 each on(more with marketing) before making their UCMJ and policy decisions. Not saying be harder or softer, just more informed.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan85</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-6956</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan85</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Feb 2007 13:29:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-6956</guid>
		<description>As a Korean-American U.S. soldier, I went to Korea with an open mind, but came to the conclusion (my opinion) that the majority of Korean people are racist, but too timid to act on it in any kind of noticeable way. Thankfully.

The majority of GI's that end up in Korea will only be there for a year. Very few Koreans speak functional English, and to think that some 18-21 year old joe is going to be able to appreciate Korean culture is being pretty optimistic. In large part due to the host nation, a lot of these kids (especially in 2ID land) are not going to have positive experiences, and incidents are going to happen.

I wonder how Koreans looked at Hines Ward's mother before he was super bowl MVP? I see billboards out here with his face on it for Christ's sake.

That said, aside from running into a few jerks, a friendly person with a bit of patience can get along almost anywhere. "Tom", if the terrible U.S. soldiers from your old unit didn't like you, it wasn't because you're Korean. You just suck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a Korean-American U.S. soldier, I went to Korea with an open mind, but came to the conclusion (my opinion) that the majority of Korean people are racist, but too timid to act on it in any kind of noticeable way. Thankfully.</p>
<p>The majority of GI&#8217;s that end up in Korea will only be there for a year. Very few Koreans speak functional English, and to think that some 18-21 year old joe is going to be able to appreciate Korean culture is being pretty optimistic. In large part due to the host nation, a lot of these kids (especially in 2ID land) are not going to have positive experiences, and incidents are going to happen.</p>
<p>I wonder how Koreans looked at Hines Ward&#8217;s mother before he was super bowl MVP? I see billboards out here with his face on it for Christ&#8217;s sake.</p>
<p>That said, aside from running into a few jerks, a friendly person with a bit of patience can get along almost anywhere. &#8220;Tom&#8221;, if the terrible U.S. soldiers from your old unit didn&#8217;t like you, it wasn&#8217;t because you&#8217;re Korean. You just suck.</p>
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		<title>By: A Solution to the Hongdae Problem at ROK Drop</title>
		<link>http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-6860</link>
		<dc:creator>A Solution to the Hongdae Problem at ROK Drop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Feb 2007 00:13:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rokdrop.com/2007/02/03/the-off-limits-game/#comment-6860</guid>
		<description>[...] soldier knows the Hongdae off limits order is not about &#34;force protection reasons&#34;, but about keeping he big, bad foreigners away from Korean women, so here is a way to do [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] soldier knows the Hongdae off limits order is not about &quot;force protection reasons&quot;, but about keeping he big, bad foreigners away from Korean women, so here is a way to do [...]</p>
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