By Max Boot is a writer I greatly respect, but I think he is way off base by endorsing this idea:
the ability to earn American citizenship through military service needn’t be limited to legal immigrants. Among the millions of illegal immigrants living in the United States are an estimated 750,000 young men and women of military age, many of whom would welcome the opportunity to become US citizens in return for serving in the armed forces.
Expanding the recruitment pool to include them would make it easier for the military to build up its ranks without having to lower its standards. And what better way for illegal immigrants to come “out of the shadows” and assimilate fully into American life than by wearing their adopted country’s uniform in wartime? [Commentary Magazine]
No matter how desperate recruiting maybe in the future, I cannot endorse this idea because there is plenty of historical precedent that shows allowing non-citizens into the military is a sign of a declining civilization:
The military historian Vegetius theorized, and has recently been supported by the historian Arthur Ferrill, that the Roman Empire – particularly the military – declined partially as a result of an influx of Germanic mercenaries into the ranks of the legions. This “Germanization” and the resultant cultural dilution or “barbarization”, led to lethargy, complacency and loyalty to the Roman commanders, instead of the Roman government, among the legions and a surge in decadence amongst Roman citizenry. [Decline of the Roman Empire]
I am a big believer that a nation that cannot enlists its own people to defend it must be a nation that is not worth defending in the first place. I believe America is still worth defending and it shouldn’t take illegal immigrants to defend it. National security cannot be treated the same as hiring illegal immigrants to pick crops in a field in order to save a buck. If the government wants to expand the military more quickly than pay the soldiers more. The defense of a nation does not come on the cheap and allowing illegal immigrants to enlist would give the nation exactly what we paid for.
6:22 am on February 17th, 2008 1
[...] I’m not so sure that this is a good idea. [...]
12:02 pm on February 17th, 2008 2
If the US restricted its military to clearly defensive uses, we'd have more than enough soldiers to defend our country.
4:35 pm on February 17th, 2008 3
GI,
Here is my view on the opening up the enlistment for illegals. I support allowing enlistment to the those who are already in US as work permit or student visa. These people already have US government approved paper work to come to US legally to get their education and to work in their profession. I rather have these highly educated and trained professionals in our military ranks than just anyone who overstayed their visitation visa or those who crossed over the border w/o any paperwork.
If a Korean international student came to US during their Middle school days in student permit and once they graduate from college, then they have to go back to Korea. Why not offer them to stay in US to serve in our military as enlisted? And after their first initial enlistment of 6 years, then they are eligible for Green Card. They are only allowed to serve in the shortage MOS where there is no security clearance required. These students are practically an American as English as their dominant language like any other 1.5 GEN Korean-American. You remember SSG Yoon who was killed in Bagram? He also came to US to study during Middle school and after his graduation from Indiana University, he came back to Korea to serve in the ROK military.
9:05 pm on February 17th, 2008 4
I have no problems with people with a pemanent residency card enlisting in the military. There are many people today serving with just a permanent residency card however I don't agree with allowing people who illegally crossed US borders to join. This is just simple outsourcing of our military and national defense in my opinion is something that should never be outsourced.
2:59 am on February 18th, 2008 5
I'm with Sonagi, but I think some plan to deal with legalizing the currently illegal immigrants needs to be orchestrated and implemented. It's not feasible to erect a wall, hunt them down and put them on the other side of it. Talk about a waste of taxpayer money. The same funds and energy could be put to a better use. Besides, it's obvious that the economy needs the workers.
While military service may be an option, it should not be the only option. Alternative service through the Peace Corps or other such service-oriented programs may be another solution. I'm sure there are people who would be reluctant to join the military in their own nations for political reasons as much as if they were legal residents/citizens of America. Besides, there may be security issues with putting foreign nationals into service, and discrimination issues by having these people disproportionately moved into more dangerous missions (much as A/A soldiers were in Vietnam).
5:28 pm on February 18th, 2008 6
No government is going to send a Gestapo force to hunt down illegal immigrants. It will never happen. The best solution IMO for illegal immigration is to go after the employers. If employers do not hire illegal immigrants they will voluntarily go back.
With the crackdown on employers there should simultaneously be a work permit system. The illegal worker goes back to their home country and applies for the work permit comes back to America and is a legal worker getting paid more than what they are as illegals as well as paying taxes. Over time there should be a set number of years they can apply for the permanent residency and then eventually citizenship.
The current system of illegal immigrants having to walk across the border and often time work for little money in poor conditions is a national disgrace that won't be fixed by allowing them to join the military.
9:03 pm on February 26th, 2008 7
GI, I think your linking the use of foreign soldiers to the decline of a civilization is a bit of a stretch.
The US military is hardly graduating disciplined legionary soldiers from basic training these days. Though you don't agree with the statement that we have lowered standards for recruits, my 2 years in recruiting saw the raising of body fat standards, increases in contracts requiring waivers, and relaxed tatoo standards, but that is an entirely different argument. The point is, we just don't have enough Americans who want to serve in the Military for the right reasons. The options are to either reinstate the draft, or open the opportunity to serve to new groups of people.
As for illegal immigrants, I feel it is an ideal opportunity for them to redeem themselves for breaking immigration law by putting their lives on the line for a chance to make things right. That is commitment, a quality that seems to be more and more wanting in young American high school students these days.
As for precedent, history is full of examples of excellent Auxilaries, including Hannibal's army, the French foreign legion, the Gurkhas, etc..
America is an Empire whether we like it or not. Empires require large armies. To expect the whole army to be American is just not realistic.
11:23 pm on April 7th, 2008 8
hahha….."The military historian Vegetius"…he was wrong about many things…in Roman empire history…the decline of Roman Empire…hhahaha..politicians…like….u do have today, "Corupt" , "unable to think" , "to act"…they are not even able to pass a bill. Roman empire senate = US Senate. and about the danger that alowing illegals joining the army…just "think"…about "US BORN CITIZENS..CRMINALS ,AND ALL THOSE WHIT A RECORD, JOINING THE MILITARY…AND COMING BACK ON THE STREETS FROM WHERE THEY LEFT IN THE FIRST PLACE"…..WHIT A GOOD TRAINING AND WHIT SKILLS…they will be ur real problem not the illegals…(i`m a illegal also)…but sincerelly some of u have to go again in school and open ur eys and ears this time..
2:47 am on April 8th, 2008 9
Vlad – Pot…kettle…black
9:18 pm on January 29th, 2009 10
I agree.. Illegals running across the border to serve in the US military shouldnt be tolerated..with the exception of the 50 plus thousand canadians that served in Vietnam…I served in the US army as well 22 years..I had a green card.. and then after a couple of years I think it was 5.. I recived permanent resident alien status.. but.. if you are a Canadian It is against the law to Join and serve in a foreign military.. well.. it used to be.. and it probably still is…I wonder who wants to tell Peter Lemon his service in Vietnam was illegal..?
11:48 pm on January 29th, 2009 11
Read Pat Buchanan's book "State of Emergency" (from cover to cover – if there are things you don't understand, do your homework and find out what they mean.) If you then don't like Buchanan's book, you are either not an American Citizen, or you don't want America to exist. This person wants to fill the ranks of the protectors of America with people of another nation? The Romans tried that once and it ruined their country pretty quickly. America seems to be following.in 1996 at the LA Colliseum there was a soccer match between Mexico and the USA. The USA National Anthem was stopped during its play because the Mexicans became so disruptive, the American flag was torn down from the flag pole, and the USA team was pelted with beer, rocks and what ever else could be thrown at them – This happened in the United States of America, its all documented, but nobody wants to remember. Good Bye USA-
8:02 pm on December 13th, 2010 12
Hello. Great job. I did not expect this on a Wednesday. This is a great story. Thanks!
4:18 am on December 14th, 2010 13
Everone, listen… THEY ARE ILLEGALS! Everything after the word ILLEGAL is moot. Are felons allowed to enlist? Why should anyone who is here ILLEGALLY be allowed to have their ILLEGALITY expunged because they spent a few years in the service? Come here legally and enlist – fine. People who engage in ILLEGAL acts under any other circumstance are usually called criminals. I know not everyone here illegally is committing crimes, other than being here without the proper documentation.
Pixel #5: Why should we have to take all the ILLEGALS and come up with a plan to make them all legal? Why not come up with a plan to make all bank robbers and rapists productive members of society? Why on earth would you think that special consideration should be given to a group of people who "cut in line" in front of everyone else trying to get here legally?
4:54 am on December 14th, 2010 14
Dragonfly,
Don't focus on the "illegal" part. That empowers those who wish to further demonize victimless "crimes" by concentrating on the "illegality" rather than their actual effects.
Allow me to re-post this… which points out actual problems rather than just complaining about the illegality.
…
Y’all are debating symptoms rather than problems.
The real problem is one of culture.
Too many illegal immigrants refuse to shed the values and attitudes that make their previous countries unlivable.
Rather than striving to assimilate, they insist on keeping their “proud heritage” in its totality… frequently even promoting anti-American nationalism in favor of the terrible places and situations they left.
…and this is all backed by a cast of the ulteriorly-motivated who encourage them to get loud in their insistence that the United States make changes to accommodate them instead of the other way ’round.
Instead of the natural process of American society being able to selectively adopt the best parts of the illegal immigrant’s cultures while rejecting parts that have proven to be counter-productive, American society is forced to accept every cultural aspect as if it is equally valuable and correct… backed up with charges of racism and bigotry for those who disagree.
Next…
There is a misconception concerning illegal immigration… a kind of cart-before-the-horse way of thinking.
Illegal immigration isn’t bad because it is “illegal”, as many like to stress. It is illegal because it is bad.
Legal immigration acts as a filter… imperfect, but a filter none-the-less.
Be it a citizen who selected his foreign bride partially on her ability to adapt to an American lifestyle or an immigration officer who believes an immigrant family is sufficiently disenchanted with their homeland enough to openly embrace the benefits that American society has to offer, there are many chances to sort out those who have no wish to make a contribution to the United States.
Illegal immigration has no such filter. Illegal immigrants do not necessarily come with the intention of making the large personal investment in the success of America that legal immigrants frequently do… and, through intention or necessity, they frequently isolate themselves from American culture, language and lifestyle.
…and now they get uppity when America doesn’t accommodate them.
5:16 am on December 14th, 2010 15
CH #14: I agree wholeheartedly. Previous immigrants came to America to be Americans. They retained their heritage while also learning the language, adopting new customs, and raising their kids to become citizens of the U.S. My problem with this whole situation is that special consideration is being sought for people who broke the law getting here and continue to break the law being here. They should not be shown any favor for citizenship, just because they're here. They need to get in line just like everyone else. No other country does this and there should be no reward for illegal behavior.
6:35 am on December 14th, 2010 16
>If the US restricted its military to clearly defensive uses, we’d have more than enough soldiers to defend our country.<
What colour is the sky of the planet you live on?