If anyone is wondering why USFK keeps Hongdae on the off limits area listing, here is a perfect example why:
At it turns out, Matt and another editor were sitting in a park near Hongdae a couple of weeks ago, and two college-aged Korean men approached them and threatened to kill them. Matt and his friend had laughed, thinking it a joke, but the two men attacked, and one of them broke a bottle and stabbed Matt in the arm.
That particular injury was ‘accidental.’ The man had aimed for Matt’s chest, but Matt had raised his arm in self-defense. Otherwise, I might be without an editor.
Matt didn’t bother to report the ‘incident’ to the police even though he’d lost a bit of blood, had seen three taxis refuse to help, and had endured the first hospital that he’d visited do little but send him on to another hospital.
"Why didn’t you report it?" I asked.
"I’ve written enough articles about police inaction when foreigners are attacked that I knew nothing would be done," he explained. [Gypsy Scholar via TMH]
The person that was stabbed was Matt Lamers who is an editor with the Korea Herald which just goes to show that GIs and English teachers are not the only ones that can be targeted by xenophobes in Korea. The Hongdae area went off limits back in 2004 in response to when American GIs were assaulted by a Korean mob of "concerned citizens" and one of the GIs pulled a knife out to defend himself from the mob that was beating him causing a small cut on one of his attackers neck. Of course the GI went to jail and nothing happened to the mob and they were in fact treated as heroes.
The area was put back on limits for a few months in 2006 by the USFK commander before being put back off limits in response to the infamous grandma rape case. There was talk about putting the area back on limits but wisely the USFK commander kept it off limits from US servicemembers. This attack is also similar to when US military Major David Berry was murdered in Itaewon by a Korean man that came up to him and stabbed him to death for no reason and no Koreans in the area stopped to help the dyeing major or his friends struggling to apprehend the attacker. At least in that case since the GIs were able to apprehend the man and he was jailed which is a rare case of justice being served when foreigners and GIs are assaulted in Korea.
12:07 pm on June 16th, 2008 1
i get the feeling that he is not telling the whole story…
[Reply]
12:48 pm on June 16th, 2008 2
[...] Like KoreaBrendon Carr (Korea Law Blog) on I Get the Feeling Obama Doesn’t Like KoreaViolence Against Foreigners in Hongdae Continues on Get Well Soon, MattKrZ on I Get the Feeling Obama Doesn’t Like KoreaBrendon Carr (Korea [...]
1:15 pm on June 16th, 2008 3
I think MAJ Berry was stabbed in Samgakji. Should that area be placed off-limits?
[Reply]
1:25 pm on June 16th, 2008 4
Along with the most likely possibility of the police doing absolutely nothing to help the victim, there is also the very real possibility of the guy going to the police only to have it turned around on him by “witnesses” and he getting charged for assault.
The police can not be trusted to help you at all, even when you are most obviously a victim of assault.
Example: the foreign girl from the “Misuda” show who was attacked and seriously beaten (possibly raped) by a Korean home invader. The police did no real investigation. It was a horrible example of law and order!
*Sorry, don’t have the links right now.
[Reply]
5:33 pm on June 16th, 2008 5
http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/14/misuda-panelist-discusses-assault-hospital-mistreatment/
Korean police are absolutely pathetic!
If they can’t get off their @$$e$ to investigate the assault and attempted kidnapping of a young Korean girl- with the whole incident caught on videtape-, then they are going to do even less when it comes to you!
[Reply]
2:34 am on June 17th, 2008 6
i get the feeling that he is not telling the whole story…
Why? Because you think unprovoked attacks only happen in AmeriKKKa, not the paradise of tolerant, open-minded, non-violent people known as Korea?
I personally know several foreigners who were physically harassed without provocation although only one was seriously injured like Matt. While waiting to catch a taxi, 30-something Canadian woman was punched so hard by a drunk Korean college student that she required extensive surgery to repair her eye socket. While she was swathed in bandages in the hospital, the man’s family begged her not to press charges, sobbing that their precious son’s future would be ruined.
A 60ish gray-haired missionary grandmother was jostled around on the subway shortly after the 1995 subway brawl hit the papers. She told me that in the past, when Koreans (usually male) bothered her, other Koreans would come to her aid, but not this time. A 6′4″ Moroccan man was assaulted a few times by groups of Korean men who wanted to show off to their friends that they could beat up the foreign giant.
If this story were about an Asian man attacked by a white man in the US, would you be so suspicious, kimchi2000? Didn’t think so. Do you recall the murder spree that took place about 10 years ago in Illinois and Indiana? A white man shot a dozen people randomly, including a Korean graduate student in his twenties. The crime was covered extensively in the Korean papers, which published a photo of the grieving father with tears streaming down his face. Right around that time, a young American English teacher was stabbed to death in a Suncheon boys’ high school by a Korean man who told the police he didn’t like foreigners teaching Korean children. This story got no direct coverage in the papers. It was publicized indirectly through a letter to the editor from the murder victim’s friend. Let’s summarize here: A Korean man is shot to death in the US, and his crying dad’s photo is published in the papers. An American man is stabbed to death in Korea, and the press ignores the story. No wonder you’re suspicious, kimchi2000. You must be a faithful reader of Chojoongdong.
[Reply]
3:23 am on June 17th, 2008 7
[...] Click here to read more. Click here to return to Korea Click here to return to MySpace News. [...]
5:40 am on June 17th, 2008 8
sonagi,
since he is a foreigner who allegedly got attacked by a kkkorean, he must be compltely innocent right? bc only innocent foreinger gets attack in korea.
usually there are 2 side of every story. do u think rodney king was 100% innocent? was he a law abiding black man who got beat up for being black? some blacks get attack for no reason and some blacks deserve to get beaten. however, NOT ALL blacks are innocent.
same goes for foreingers in korea as well. im sure some are innocent while others are not. al sharpton never sees a fault in his people and always sees his people as victims. i think expat like urself should stop acting like al sharpton and be more like bill cosby.
[Reply]
5:57 am on June 17th, 2008 9
Matt Lamers is well-known and respected among the foreign community. If this were a word-of-mouth about an unknown person, I would not take the story at face value.
[Reply]
8:34 am on June 17th, 2008 10
kimchi2000, I think you’re a racist xenophobe just like the majority of folks in Korea.
I’ve had people try to explain to me how Koreans as a society aren’t just plain racists; that they just don’t know much about foreigners so they are scared of them. Well, that’s racism. Blacks people are just here to rape our women, unless they are half Korean, play football, and allow Koreans to think they are upping their image as a nation. Blacks are dirty, unless they are playing basketball in a Hyori music video, then they are ok. White English teachers all smoke weed and party.
[Reply]
1:06 am on June 18th, 2008 11
dan85,
i am racist??
i didnt say anything about blacks being dirty. i dont know where u got that from (perhaps maybe YOU think blacks are dirty?). all white english teachers do drugs and party? well maybe that’s true
[Reply]
1:33 am on June 18th, 2008 12
I agree with Kimchi2000, this whole things smells of fish. Maybe a drunk american english teacher wanted the drugs of Matt. Maybe Matt was high on drugs like PCP with pot. Police should give him lie detector.
[Reply]
6:41 am on June 18th, 2008 13
It getting to a point where these peceuliar incidents out of Korea will eventually boil over unto American News, and it wont be good for Korea at all.
[Reply]
7:52 am on June 18th, 2008 14
It won’t happen.
This has been going on for years and years and years.
Korea had to go absolutely batshit in 2002 before the US media would give it serious consideration —
and by serious consideration – I mean to a significant extent – they did more than let Koreans working for the news wires define the story – or the US Embassy people who sing kumbiya….or however you spell it…
[Reply]
1:34 am on June 24th, 2008 15
As a new contributor to this blog, I apologize for this long post but believe I can provide some additional perspective.
Although I had spent years in Korea and speak Korean fluently having graduated from the Korean Army College, it wasn’t until I entered the “Twilight Zone” of a false accusation and in police custody at the Itaewon Police Box that I received my post-graduate education in Korean justice.
The year was 1989, on this particular evening, I had just left the UN Compound and was about to pull out from some apartments near Itaewon heading up the hill to the main road at the Burger King intersection. As I sat in my car waiting to make a left turn onto the street, I observed two young girls holding hands and preparing to run across the busy street and I thought it looked like a bad situation. As I watched, to my horror, the girls suddenly dashed into the street, were struck by a taxi and thrown to the side of the road. The taxi sped on without looking back.
I jumped out of my car, ran to the girls, checked them for injuries (I started my military career as a Navy Corpsman) picked one up, checked her for serious injuries and moved her to the sidewalk, consoled the other and began shouting directions in Korean to the those standing by to call an ambulance. I asked if anyone knew the children and asked someone to call their parents. Soon an ambulance arrived and one child left for the hospital and the other less injured child was taken to her home. I then returned to my car and drove toward the main drag in Itaewon where I had been headed when this all took place. As I stopped at the light in front of the Burger King, a small mob suddenly surrounded my car and began slapping and pounding on it. I recall thinking “what the hell?” I had no idea what was going on but some policeman appeared and literally dragged me from my car and hustled me off to the Itaewon Police Box where I was told to sit and wait. This was the time you would expect Rod Sterling voice to announce “you have just entered the Twilight Zone.” It was that unreal.
I protested that I had done nothing except try to aid the children who had been struck by a taxi. “If you were not at fault, why would you have stopped” I was asked by one incredulous policeman? I explained what had happened and he took me roughly by the arm and suggested we both go to the “scene of the crime.”
Once there, he asked the surrounding shop keepers if they had seen the American run over the Korean children. To my shock and dismay, several Koreans came forward as witnesses that they had indeed seen me callously run over the children and then try to flee the scene. I was so stunned and outraged by what I was hearing that I shouted back in Korean that they were lying and I might have thrown in something about their relationship to female dogs. OK, I’m pretty sure the whole son of bitch thing got mixed in which probably didn’t help because at that moment, I truly was a crazy America and I was in the middle of a nightmare and it wasn’t going away.
Soon the very “helpful” Korean national investigator from the Yongsan Garrison arrived and quickly threw me under the bus. Seriously the guy was a complete jerk and assumed I was at fault as well and largely ignored me and my protestations of innocence. Even now as I write this, I can’t fully believe this actually happened.
We returned to the police box and the parents of the two girls arrived with the child who had been less injured. The police pointed to me and asked her if I was the one who had run down her and her sister. “Aniyo,” and “taxi” she replied confirming what I had told the police. They asked her again pointing to me and indicating that I was the one who had run her down. When she insisted that it had been a taxi once again, the Korean police concluded that she was obviously too young and too traumatized to give a “proper” answer and her testimony was disregarded.
In the meantime, I called my wife who happened to be teaching English to four Korean college students at our home in Blackhawk Village. These very naïve students often enjoyed debating anti-Americanism and exchanging views with me. I asked the college students to come up and observe Korean justice in action and they arrived about 15 minutes later. In the meantime, I had decided that since I was going nowhere fast, I might as well write out in Korean and English my version of events so I would have a contemporaneous record as they say. When the college students arrived, they leaned over and corrected my spelling and grammar and offered helpful suggestions. When I finished with the written statement, I handed it to the police investigator who was more than a little surprised to receive a statement written in Korean and for the first time appeared to have some doubts. Also, a police captain from the main Korean Yongsan police station arrived and when he read my statement, he too seemed to have some doubts. So, once again, they walked me back to the “scene of the crime.” At this point, the security guard from the apartments walked over to us. He had been on duty and had seen the accident and he quickly confirmed that I had done nothing wrong and had simply tried to provide first aid.
You might imagine at this point, the Korean Police would have been embarrassed and would have apologized for their actions. And you would be wrong. No apology, no acknowledgement of their mistake, the police captain gave me a sort of push and tole me to “nak ka ra” or get the hell out of here and frankly I was pretty happy to “nak ka ra.” The Korean college students had stuck around and observed how this played out and were in a state of shock by what they had observed. Frankly so was I. In fact I’m still a bit shocked.
At the time, I was the US aide to a Korean 4-star general. I had graduated from the Korean Army College and had spent 7 years in Korea. My senior rater was the USFK Commander. I had appeared on Korean television, I had participated in foreigner song contests and speech contests and was invited and welcomed in some of the best homes in Korea. If this could happen to me, what chance does your normal GI have when falsely accused? The answer is none, absolutely no chance. I was a hair away from a conviction in Korean court based on false testimony from racist, lying witnesses and not only was I not guilty but my behavior in most societies would be considered honorable and decent. I stopped to provide assistance to Korean children in distress. Koreans may attend Christian churches but the “good Samaritan” story has not translated well.
In the weeks that followed as my story made the rounds on Yongsan, I was contacted by a number of folks had had similar experiences. One American medical doctor told me it cost him five thousand dollars to make his case go away after similarly stopping at the scene of a wreck and being accused because “why else would he have stopped?”
Based on my experience, I know that unless you have a full confession from a foreign defendant, I wouldn’t believe a word any witness said against them. In my case, people assumed I was guilty because I was an American and because I stopped to help.
[Reply]
8:14 am on June 24th, 2008 16
DMZ Dave great comment and I am actually going to expand on this in an upcoming posting.
[Reply]
8:42 am on June 24th, 2008 17
Good post, DMZDave…
Perhaps this reflects 1989 Korea more than 2008 Korea… maybe… hopefully…
…mostly, I hope I don’t have to find out.
Had this happened to me, I would have been on the phone to the Korean 4-star or the owners of some of those fine houses. They could have quickly explained your “special situation”… and the cops, most likely, would have apologized and moved on.
I must say, I have had no shortage of ranking people throughout Asia give me their cards and say, “If you ever have any problem, I can help you.”
Yet another reason to live here.
[Reply]
9:52 am on June 24th, 2008 18
[...] This comment by DMZ Dave provides a perfect example that justice for American servicemembers in Korea remains little changed over the years: As a new contributor to this blog, I apologize for this long post but believe I can provide some additional perspective. [...]
9:56 am on June 24th, 2008 19
“I jumped out of my car”
That is the fatal error many non Koreans make. As the old saying goes “when in Rome….” Myself, I have been trained in first aid and have had the opportunity to intervene in several accidents, but I follow the Korean model and stand and stare.
As everyone who has lived in Korea knows, “no good deed in Korea goes unpunished”. If you try and help a Korean, you put your life and livelihood at risk. You put your family in jeopardy. I have also learned the hard way that when a Korean gets hurt and a non Korean helps them. The Korean suddenly sees dollar signs and feels no gratitude.
I am sure that some bitter apologist non Korean will lash out at me for “acting Korean” and not intervening or using my first aid training to help a Korean in distress, and I say to him, where is your contempt for Koreans who stand around and watch people die? Thought so
“Yet another reason to live here.”
My understanding, from what my Korean friends tell me and what I read from the Korean press, is that Americans make money beyond their imagination in Korea. Money they could never dream of making in the USA. Losers in America are treated like kings in Korea. No wonder Korean 4 stars give you their cards and offer to bail you out of trouble. Damn, I don’t blame you for worshiping Korea.
[Reply]
12:03 pm on June 24th, 2008 20
shattered,
You got that one right.
Stinkin’ Hippies, Know-It-All Graduates and Divorced Losers at a Dead-End come to Korea to “teach” English in shocking numbers… and get treated very, very well while making more money than they ever dreamed of Back Home… with fewer working hours… and a pretty free ride for housing and other expenses.
This happens because of Korea’s Confucian attitude toward teachers as well as the inability for many young students to quickly differentiate between Winners and Losers across the East/West cultural gap… as well as basic Korean face-to-face politeness which allows them to smile and act respectful regardless of what they are truly thinking.
Further, many students will exchange fake respect for a small increase in English ability which may beat out their Standardized Test Competitors in the Korean Game of Life.
…hard to decide which is worse… the players or the game, eh?
However…
Koreans, especially higher-society ones, are hardly stupid… and many of them are very, very good at long-term planning.
While they may “use” any scumbag English “teacher” to increase their English ability, older/smarter/more experienced Koreans will go out of their way to build relationships with Westerners they deem to be above average.
For this reason, if you have anything going for you… good manners, profession appearance, exceptional education… it is possible to be introduced to a higher social set in Korea than possible Back Home.
As less-strict social rules apply to foreigners,if you are pleasant and useful, you will be included and accepted… or tolerated, depending on how you want to look at it.
This can open a world of opportunity for a foreigner who is willing to learn the social rules (in a very forgiving environment) and make certain sacrifices to receive the rewards.
Yet another reason to live here.
[Reply]
12:12 pm on June 24th, 2008 21
DMZDave,
Back in the US, my mother and I got into an accident nearby a shopping mall parking area. My Mother was driving the car and other driver hit us in the rear. Even though we were rear ended by the other driver, “Witnesses” came out of Mall and start claiming that we back into the other car. Even though we were going forward. Also all these “nice” witnesses even referred to me as the driver of the car even though I was only 14 at that time. (I was speaking on behalf of my mother who could not speak English at all.) If they actaully witnessed the accident, they would have all seen me coming out of passenger side of the car. As you can tell the other car drivers were White and all witnesses were White. All these White witnesses made sure that me and my mother did not flee the scene of the accident until the Police arrived. (We never plan on fleeing the scene.) We were so scared that we might end up in jail or something worse. The Police saw the condition of both vehicles and talk to both drivers and found out that fault of accident was the other driver. When the other driver found out that she was getting the traffic citation, she start to screaming all the racist words at us and White “Witnesses” start yelling at us to “go back to your country you Chink!!” The Police had to call for back up to control all these White “witnesses” who might turn violent. We were escorted by the Police all the way home from that Shopping Mall Parking lot that day. It was most scarest moment of my life in US.
[Reply]
12:35 pm on June 24th, 2008 22
“When the other driver found out that she was getting the traffic citation, she start to screaming all the racist words at us and White “Witnesses” start yelling at us to “go back to your country you Chink!!”
A very hard to believe story. Koreans always come up with the wildest “racism” stories. Funny how Viet, Japanese, Chinese..etc get along just fine. Makes you go hmmm….
[Reply]
1:17 pm on June 24th, 2008 23
Yes, that is very hard to believe, shattered.
[Reply]
1:46 pm on June 24th, 2008 24
In regards to Cpt Kim’s story the fact that some white people could act racist towards Asians is plausible however I have never seen such a thing happen myself and if I did I doubt I could be able to keep my big mouth shut if people were acting that stupid.
With that said the important note from this story is how professional the police acted in response where ethnic loyalties played no part in their investigation and ultimately rendered fault where it belonged.
[Reply]
4:21 pm on June 24th, 2008 25
I second GI Korea’s comment — “[T]he important note from this story [of Cpt KIM's traffic-accident/racism encounter as a kid] is how professional the police acted…” Unfortunately, Korea’s police and prosecutors are not professional according to our American definition of professionalism. They do not seek the truth, because their society does not value the truth. “Go along to get along” is the motto.
[Reply]
4:27 pm on June 24th, 2008 26
“Korean face-to-face politeness which allows them to smile and act respectful ”
Its hard to tell when you are joking sometimes. But just in case you are not joking, what is the color of the sky on your world?
[Reply]
12:19 am on June 25th, 2008 27
As to [ Cpt Kim's] accident; I gotta call BS.
in my little “po-dunk” town the “chink” is an unknown term. Now if Cpt Kim had said the term “Jap”, I might have believed him.
In my little “po-dunk” town, ALL asian folks are “japs”. They make the cars and bombed Pearl. Korea? “What is that?” The only reason I know of korea is my three tours there.
Although, my local radio station now has mentioned korea because of the us-beef issue, and they really enjoyed the article I sent them about “fan death”.
[Reply]
12:20 am on June 25th, 2008 28
First, let me say that I appreciate this forum and certainly appreciate the manner in which GI Korea debunks the many myths surrounding the Korean press version of events. After my incident, the following morning in my office, our ROK Army Sergeant Major was incredulous and admonished me for not having called him because he would have been able to quickly resolve it. There is no doubt that he could. There were indeed any number of people I could have called that would have been helpful but in the middle of that Twilight Zone, I still had faith (a bit naively I admit) that I could use my own language skills and knowledge of Korea to work my way through it.
I also appreciate CPT Kim’s unintentional pro-American story although he seems to miss the larger point. Even if we are to believe that he was surrounded by a racist, lying mob as I was, in his story, the professional police officers ignored the mob, did their duty and identified the true cause of the accident and cited the other driver – God Bless America.
As for Chickenhead’s decision to “act Korean” and pass on by an accident, I can certainly see the wisdom of his decision. Less than 6 months after my own experience, I came upon the scene of an accident near Uijongbu where a truck had run into an old man walking on the side of the road. I stopped my military vehicle and one of my medics rendered first aid. As soon as we stopped,the truck driver who had struck the pedestrian got ready to leave. I stopped him, pulled his keys of his ignition and said “you aren’t going anywhere until the police and ambulance arrive.”
The point is, I would still stop at the scene of an accident today in Korea to render assistance. I don’t for a minute believe that most injured Koreans see dollars when an American stops to render assistance or is othewise involved in an accident. I do believe that the Korean press has a number of racist reporters who have lied so consistently and for so long about the motives and behavior of Americans that there is indeed often a presumption of guilt when a soldier is involved in an incident. Frankly, Koreans are more often than not just as shocked as Americans are when I relate my Itaewon experience. It was not my purpose here to further inflame. It was meant as a cautionary tale and to help others who may be new to Korea understand that in a good number of cases where a soldier is accused of a crime, USFK should always follow that basic American legal principle and presume soldiers are innocent until proven guilty and that they should fight for them with every legal tool available. Soldiers come to Korea to protect and serve and the American people expect their commanders to protect and serve them as well.
[Reply]
1:51 am on June 25th, 2008 29
DMZDave… duuude!
It was shattered, not me, who passed by the accident.
I always stop and gently pull off the ajushi who is, more often than not, slapping the unconscious victim and yelling, “Yah! Get up!”
For 2 years I lived in a love motel on the corner of a 6 lane bridge and a riverside road with no stop light. Late at night, as people tried to cross all 6 lanes to continue on the riverside road I got to hear, “Hoooooonk! Screeeeeech! BOOM!” at least once every other month. (as opposed to American Style: Screeech! Hooooonk! Funk You!)
The first time, I was unsure what to do… but by the third one, I had it down. It got to the point where I kept loads of gauze and a box of Latex gloves by the door (those have other uses, by the way, in case there aren’t enough accidents).
I told the yogwan ajuma to call 119 (being on the ground floor with the TV on, she seldom heard it). I then went out to see if it was one or two seatbelt-less drunks that had just shattered a cigarette pack-sized area at the top of the windshield with their forehead or nose.
Fortunately, I never had to deal with anything serious… broken noses, deep cuts, probable fractures and probable neck injuries… my nightmare was going out and finding some kid with his guts hanging out… or brain exposed while he looked into my eyes.
Most of the time, 4 or 5 tow trucks arrived first, followed by an ambulance or two… and usually (but not always) a cop before I left.
It was painful to watch the rough and careless 8282 treatment by the “paramedics”.
Once an older cop arrived just after I did… and, I shyte you not, he mosied out of his car and across the street, uninterested-ly peered over my shoulder as I was instructing the gangster-looking drunk in the Pride to keep the gauze pressed over the gash in his forehead, and then mosied back to his car and diddled around with the radio.
I always smiled at all the drivers and cops and carried on about business and was never hassled. A few times someone questioned me and I just told them I lived in that building over there and this happens pretty frequently.
As a side note, if USFK would like to be a REAL good neighbor, they should set up a program where our truly professional American military medical personnel go around to Korean hospitals and train their EMTs in pre-hospital advanced medical and trauma care.
That would rock a lot more than any number of on-base/post golf courses serving the local whorebar-owing “civic leaders”.
Also, I am on a scuba search and rescue team… which means when there is a flood and people are missing or somebody jumps into a river because their girlfriend married a guy with a bigger Hyundai, we go looking for them… by feel. Thankfully, I haven’t found a body yet.
Oh, yes… and don’t let anybody tell you the soju doesn’t come out just about the time the gear is put away.
[Reply]
2:51 am on June 25th, 2008 30
Chickenhead: Good stoires. Sorry about the mix-up. Glad you continue to act the way your momma raised you with some obvious exceptions I’m sure. Feeling around for a body on the bottom of the Han River would definitely call for some heavy soju pain reliever.
[Reply]
3:55 am on June 25th, 2008 31
“It was shattered, not me, who passed by the accident. ”
LOL.IT WAS SHATTERD! IT WAS SHATTERED! I would have thoght you had more class then to blame me for things I have nothing to do with. You are becoming more and more Korean everyday.
I guess if my dog goes missing I should blame you? Don’t fear chicken, I wont do that. (can I ask the same?, or have you sold your pride for rotten cabbage?)
[Reply]
4:04 am on June 25th, 2008 32
“As to [ Cpt Kim’s] accident; I gotta call BS.”
Yep, a KKK convention of random people in a parking lot is hard to swallow. Anybody who has seen a Korean in a car accident will tell you that Koreans will yell bloody murder in order to intimidate people. The more guilty the Korea the more hell they raise. I suspect Kim’s mom was drunk on Suju.
[Reply]
6:07 am on June 25th, 2008 33
To be fair, I have another favorite story of pride and prejudice, police and Korea. I don’t know what it is about the Land of the Morning Calm that causes police and MPs to lose their minds.
I have a good buddy who was, at the time. a Korean America MP officer. One day as he stepped out of the PX in Yongsan he was confronted by a really stupid, off duty MP who for some unknown reason made a career ending decision and demanded to see my friend’s receipt and military identification. My buddy calmly responded, “OK, here’s how we’re going to play this. I’m going to show you my ID and the receipt for my purchases and then you are going to show me your ID. Everytime you refer to me from this moment forward, you will call me ’sir’ and after you see my identification, you are going to accompany me to the Yongsan military police station where you will be placed in confinement until your commander is able to come pick you up and while you are waiting you can reflect on what MOS you may want to pursue because I promise you, you aren’t going to be an MP after today.” It was truly one of those beautiful moments in life. Ironically my buddy had actually commanded the kid’s MP company several years before.
[Reply]
10:56 am on June 25th, 2008 34
Shattered,
FYI, the accident took place in Cook County suburb of Chicago in mid 80’s. All Police officers were all Whites and thank God that they were all professional and did their job unlike Korean Police. My mother does not drink.
DMZDave,
Similar thing happened to me in Taegu when a newly arrived 2LT tried to order me to pick up his duffel bags. I was in my PT uniform outside of my unit bldg. I just say “Yes Sir!” and did what he asked me to do. Once we entered the orderly room, he saw the company commander’s photo and realized that I am his new commander. He later apolosized and explained to me that he thought I was a KATUSA b/c he heard me speaking Korean to other KATUSA soldiers. I thanked him that he thought I looked that young to be a KATUSA. I was over 30 years old at that time.
[Reply]
2:13 pm on June 25th, 2008 35
I think Cpt KIM handled his awkward situation with more grace and goodwill than the Korean-American officer in DMZDave’s story. Have a sense of humor about things and everything gets more tolerable.
[Reply]
2:56 pm on June 25th, 2008 36
I don’t know the rules on how this is done, but it seems only reasonable that a MP in uniform or even without uniform should be able to ask anybody on an overseas US Military base to produce ID. Maybe I don’t understand the security situation, but it makes sence to me.
So a off duty MP asked to see ID. Seems reasonable. Did your Korean friend have his rank tatooed on his forehead? How was that MP supposed to know. Your Korean friend seems to have real issues. I hope the military washes him out before its too late.
Also, last I heard its Koreans that are running all the black marketing. Unless you think some fresh off the farm GI who just lands for his one year tour in Korea is setting up his own little black market operation. So with that in mind, asknig Koreans for their ID is logical too.
It seems that the Korean was the racist here. I doubt he would have f-ed over that MP if he was another Korean.
[Reply]
7:43 am on June 28th, 2008 37
Shattered: My buddy, the Korean American officer was going about his business, shopping at the PX and there was no probable cause for him to be approached by an MP and certainly no reason to ask him to produce an ID card. He was quite simply racially profiled and asked to produce his ID and a receipt for his purchases by a foolish racist 2ID soldier. As it turned the MP was off duty from his unit in the 2ID in Yongsan so he had absolutely no authority and certainly no jurisdiction to ask anyone for an ID card on Yongsan. He was not acting under orders and had no authority but was indeed “out of control” and acting illegaly. My friend played it exactly as he should have as a professional military officer. That young MP was bad news and abused his power, position and authority. Unlike Captain Kim’s story, this one involves both illegal and racist behavior on the part of the young GI which was exactly how his commander saw it as well.
Fortunately the Army did not wash my friend out and he went on to have an illustrious military career and contributed greatly to our national security at the highest levels and put his life at risk on a number of occasions in the service of his country, the United States of America. As an MP officer, my buddy simply had a strong aversion to MPs who abused their authority and in my experience he would have certainly dealt just as strongly with a Korean American MP who similarly abused his authority and position but you’ll have to take my word for that.
CPT Kim, loved your story too (almost too good to be true) but strongly disagree with Brendan Carr’s comments. Your story involved the kind of racial stereotyping I am learning from this blog one might expect from Shattered (ignorant but not illegal) and you did indeed handle it very well. My buddy’s story bordered on racism and the MP behavior was and illegal abuse of authority and that called for a tougher response.
[Reply]
3:13 pm on August 28th, 2008 38
I know I’m a little late, but I’ve found myself nodding in agreement and shaking my head in disbelief as I’ve scrolled through this thread. Surprisingly, not all Koreans are oblivious or in denial of this “screw the wae guk in” phenomenon.
I was in Sillim with my girlfriend, a Korean citizen, walking through one of the tight alleys between the main roads when we heard a loud crash against an aluminum garage type door. There were cars parked tightly along the building inches from the door, so we couldn’t see what was happening, but as we passed the area of the crash, we noticed a young man lying face down on the ground between two cars having a seizure. I am a medical professional in the army, so my first instinct was to help him and ensure that he doesn’t recieve any injuries during the seizure. His face was against a metal drain grate and when I turned him over onto his back I could see that his nose was broken and his face was covered in blood. I stayed next to him and waited for the seizure to end, then asked my girlfriend to translate as I asked him if he needed any help getting to a doctor to treat his nose. He didn’t respond, and looked extremely embarrassed…almost angry. He had another small seizure and we stayed with him until it ended so that he would not hurt himself any more. He never said anything to either of us, but simply glared like we had done something wrong to him. My girlfriend quickly said that we should leave, because I might get into trouble. I didn’t understand why, and I didn’t want to leave because he obviously didn’t have any medication and he could have another seizure at any moment. She explained to me that from an outsiders perspective it looked like I had severely beaten the guy, and being an American could instigate alot of problems from potential “witnesses” and possibly even the seizure victim himself, who was obviously embarrassed and continuously glaring at me as if it were my fault he was hurt. She wondered why he had come between two closely parked cars, which were parked almost directly against the garage door, unless he knew the seizure was coming and might be ashamed to be seen in public in that condition. He may try to claim that I had assaulted him, and given the location and his condition, I probably would have believed it myself if I had been a passerby.
Another Korean man came by, and when my girlfriend explained what happened he told us to leave and that he would stay with the young man until help arrived. She said that the man felt the same way she did, and that it would be in my best interest to leave.
It’s in my nature to help someone who is hurt, and it is also my job, but I can’t understand a culture that would defame another person’s character to save face and avoid embarrassment. I don’t know if he would have made any false claims against me or not ( I like to think that he wouldn’t have), but I’m grateful that my girlfriend was there to ensure my safety from the potential of ruthless slander and a ruined life, all because I cared.
[Reply]
5:03 am on August 29th, 2008 39
DMZ Dave/Chickenhead:
Have to agree with you on helping people when they are in need. If SOME ignorant & racist Koreans/Asians want to pull their racist B/S, then they will eventually suffer from their lying and false accusations, as many of these Asian countries are.
I have seen this same attitude in other Asian countries and it never ceases to amaze me how a culture can be so uncaring about it’s fellow citizens. However, there are just some situations that I would make an instant decision to ignore and keep on going for exactly the same reasons that many of the posters have outlined…especially in instances where alcohol is obviously the cause (they can suffer the misfortunes of their own stupidity), or where there is already a crowd of the indigenous population milling around. This is probably the best way to approach any of tese siuations…let the locals attempt to provide assistance first and then ask them if they would like you to assist them. CYA!
As DMZ Dave pointed out after the fact, you should always have persons/numbers that you should contact in the event of one of these situations and let the established authorities hash it out. Unfortunately, private citizens are often left out in the cold in these countries, as the U.S. Embassy is about useless.
I have been in a car accident in the Philippines, where we were rear-ended by a large truck…not one Filipino offered assistance and there were many standing around by a store and small coffee shop just gawking. That told me volumes about their culture. Have observed the same attitude in Thailand, korea, etc. It really makes you wonder about Asian cultures and their values.
In contrast, I have seen many accidents in America, where complete strangers will stop and offer in-depth assistance…w/o even thinking about the consequences.
While Asia can be a neat place to live, it does take a callous individual to tolerate their indifference towards human life.
[Reply]