Here is some news for all you USFK contractors out there:
U.S. Forces Korea officials are denying status of forces agreement visa renewals to many civilian contractors who lived in South Korea under a different visa when they were hired.
Most contractors who lived in South Korea for more than a year under a different visa — even if that was 15 years ago — are considered “ordinarily resident” in South Korea and are ineligible for SOFA status, according to USFK regulations.
The sudden scrutiny comes on the heels of an audit of USFK’s procedures and its compliance with the regulation guiding the invited contractor program.
“An ongoing Army Audit Agency audit has revealed that USFK Regulation 700-19 was not properly enforced by [USFK Chief of Staff, Acquisition Management],” USFK wrote via e-mail following a Stars and Stripes query.
As a result, some invited contractors who have worked with USFK for decades and have top secret clearances are losing their SOFA visas — and in some cases, the jobs that require that status. [Stars & Stripes]
Hopefully none of you contractors out there reading this lose your job over something that is not your fault like this.
Popularity: 2%
2:13 pm on October 7th, 2008 1
Simply put, the “Old Boy” network
has outlived it’s legality. F-2’s
anyone? I got mine!
3:39 pm on October 7th, 2008 2
Perhaps they are culling the herd. It almost seems like a good excuse to thin the ranks of overpriced contractors. If truely needed, they can be replaced by a cheaper model.
6:28 pm on October 7th, 2008 3
“overpriced contractors” Ha. In most cases contractors are cheaper overseas than civil service employees and have technical skills that the DACs do not. What “cheaper model” would you suggest? Filipino Prostitutes? Outsource to India? Please remember when you hear contractors down at the bar talking salary and comparing penis size it is always a little bit bigger than reality.
7:45 pm on October 7th, 2008 4
“We have met the enemy…and it is us.”
The military always loves to slam contractors, but contractors supporting the military go back to the Revolution…the military couldn’t go it alone then, and they damn sure cannot do it now.
I always find it ironic that the same people who are bad mouthing contractors, are usually the same ones trying to buddy up with us come ETS time. Such Hypocrites.
8:14 pm on October 7th, 2008 5
Hold on guys, I’m a DAC and I have worked with contractors in Korea. Those contractors are not cheap.
1. Tax free income
2. per diem @ 70.00 a day x 7 days
3. No Housing oversight= living in a 4 room hooch @ 4 to 500 a month
4. Same PX, Commissary and MWR as DACs
5. Add retired military to the mix = lucrative job
6. Freedom of movement, leave Korea one week, be in another country the next week.
8:17 pm on October 7th, 2008 6
Oh yeah, I forget those same Contractors, are knocking on Civil Service doors every chance they get.
9:38 pm on October 7th, 2008 7
“Oh yeah, I forget those same Contractors, are knocking on Civil Service doors every chance they get.”
Well, you do get tired of having to actually be productive at a realistic level and always having to worry about being terminated due to budget changes.A GS is eternal no matter how worthless they are they cannot lose their job. So it is attractive to get into Civil Service depending on your moral standings.
10:57 pm on October 7th, 2008 8
I have to say this about we Americans…we are the backstabbingest, infighting, dog-eat-dog sonsofbitches that I have ever laid eyes on.
We ARE definitely not on the same side according to the attitudes that I have dealt with in various countries.
It really saddens me to hear the attitudes of military, government workers, etc. Do any of you have a monopoly on your sector? Hell no!
Which one of you do NOT aspire to improve your situation in Life?
Guys…it is getting to the point that “Divided we are definitely going to fall!”
12:29 am on October 8th, 2008 9
Bones, tell me this. If everything you said in post #5 was true and it was such a lucrative job why would they always knock on civil service doors every chance they get?
1. Tax Free - Contractors don’t define the IRS rules…
2. Never heard of this, can you tell me which company/contract this is? I would like to apply! Sounds like urban legend to me.
3. Housing oversight depends on the company and the contract. If a contractor can get a house for 400-500 a month why does a responsible civil servant not do the same thing instead finding a place at the top of the range?
4. Adding retired military into the mix is irrelevant. A retirement is earned on it’s own merits and the benefits are paid to anyone who earned it, doesn’t matter if they are contractor, civil servant or work in another industry.
6. Not sure what you mean here. If you leave korea one week you most likely will be in another country. That is generally what happens when you leave a country. Is there some reason that does not happen to civil servants when they leave korea?
We are all here to support the US govt. Everyone here gets paid for the work that they do wether they are military, civil servant or contractor. The current investigation only covered contractors through CCK. I wonder how many civil servants got through with SOFA designation when they were not “ordnarily resident in the US” when they were hired…
1:55 am on October 8th, 2008 10
There are many contractors here for the cash.
There are many here because we have family here. I have family ties and will stay irregardless. Let the one’s who have no interest in making this country better go.
Unfortunately, I have known many overpaid contractors to take advantage of the system currently in place.
4:23 am on October 8th, 2008 11
I have too disagree with your depiction of contractors being money grubbers. Some of us are here doing our old military jobs. My personal one is in training. Some of us still give a damn about our guys, believe it or not.
It comes down to the bi-annual contracting office purge. I’ve personally seen too many KGS’s driving BMW SUV’s. Someone got their pee-pee whacked and it’s easier to blame the contractors than fix your system.
USFK Reg 700-19 clearly states - A local hire must be in Korea over one year under other than SOFA status. My personnel and myself were all hired from the States and have been SOFA from the start.
To quote the immortal Bob Dylan “You don’t need a weather man to know which way the wind blows”.
My prediction we are out of here, hope your resume is up to date. More power to them I know I’ve certainly had enough of the ROK tripe.
Really if I had one bit of care left in me I would say let’s organize. Since we all know our companies don’t give a rip. BTW, if there’s any contractors out there that knows what I’m talking about I can be contacted at ron3elvis@gmail.com.
4:34 am on October 8th, 2008 12
For all you contractors out there, if your a local hire then you had better look into this. If you were brought over from the states AND all your paperwork was completed before you arrived you have nothing to worry about. In the case of Mr Boeck (Stripes article) he was brought over but when he didn’t work for a year he stayed in Korea and came back to the contract again. Having met him I feel for his stiuation, but it’s about time they finally cleaned up a VERY corrupt program (Contracting Command)that has been running in Yongsan for Decades. He is just a victom of this corrupt system.
Bones:
Being a contractor and working daily with DACs I can say that both sides tend to stab each other in the back. From what I have seen many of them bring this over from the states or Iraq/Afganastan. It only takes one bad encounter with the other side and the bad taste sticks with you. I’ve been lucky as the DACs I’ve worked with have been easy going guys.
4:42 am on October 8th, 2008 13
kormatt
But this is not what USACCK is doing, they are shaking us all down. Every time you contact them they give a different answer to why you lost your SOFA. Per their regulations we are legal. They won’t give any name as POC. Not to be a revolutionary but do I here the word organize in our future?
5:36 am on October 8th, 2008 14
ron3elvis, this brings up other interesting questions (not to side track the conversation) and not to be revolutionary at all. But I have often wondered…
I am a US citizen
I work for a US company
I work on a US government contract US base (in theory at least, US sovereign territory)
Why is it that I am not afforded the protections of US labor laws? In the mean time, DACs have many protections and rights. Just a thought.
5:47 am on October 8th, 2008 15
Gents interesting discussion. When you guys are talking about corruption with the contracting what exactly are you guys referring too? For example are there people with contract jobs that are doing next to nothing but are getting paid because their buddy hired them?
6:44 am on October 8th, 2008 16
“Why is it that I am not afforded the protections of US labor laws? In the mean time, DACs have many protections and rights. Just a thought.”
This is tied into the Tax Free thing. And let’s remember that it is only tax free up to a certain point and the ceiling isn’t that high.
So, does anyone personnally know someone this has happened too? I have heard of one individual but it was weeks ago before this story ran in the stripes. I know of many people it should affect… mostly retires that like to take a few years off from work and hang out here then get another job that comes by. I think these are the real targets of the operation.
9:30 am on October 8th, 2008 17
GI,
A company can hire anyone they want. The Contracting Officer/QA/approving authority still has to approve. Needless to say, it behooves a company to hire the best at the best price. And it behooves the customer to report any problems to the person that has oversight on the contract. Most times, the customer does not and this encourages sloppiness. So whose at fault, the contractor that hires sub-standard workers, the QA that looks the other way or the Colonel that takes the kickback?
I don’t know anything about the corruption with the current US contractors, but I would sure like this magnifying glass turned on the local contractors, especially DPW. Have you seen how shoddy the construction is and how often they need to be “upgraded” or retrofitted? The oversight at DPW is responsible, but a fat white envelope makes everything alright.
Now, having been a soldier, GS, and contractor and having & had been bad mouth by all three, it comes down to a personal decision and oversight. All 3 classes will screw-off given the opportunity, and all 3 will perform when held to standard. Currently being a contractor, it embarrasses me when I see incompetence in any class, but it’s not my responsibility to report this (out of my lane). I merit my pay because I have specialized knowledge that the government is unwilling or unable to pay for in their GS’s or soldiers. Should soldiers get paid more, absolutely, but so should teachers. It’s systematic, so blame the system and change it. Don’t be jealous of us contractors because you didn’t make a better business decision or you didn’t measure up to the needs of the industry. Free market baby!
In my opinion, it costs the government less to hire contractors. The government makes a contract that is bid upon and (usually) the best value (not always the cheapest) is picked. The price is relatively stable with incentives and punishments. The company that wins is responsible for Human Resources, 401k’s, training, medical and other goodies that taxpayers don’t have to pay for as with GS’s and soldiers. In addition, we contractors generally have to stay on the leading edge and constantly (re)train ourselves, sometimes out of pocket. We know that the next day we could be job hunting, so we stay hungry **Que “Eye of the Tiger ** But that’s what it takes to demand a decent salary.
The saying goes, “Government Service is where all contractors go to die.”
4:20 pm on October 8th, 2008 18
its outrageous why does this not apply to the DAC’s as well?
many of them were hired locally and worked out deals to get LQA even though the rule says you are entitled to that if hired from the US
CCK and the Civilian Personnel Office are two of the most corrupt places on base
right behind AFFES
8:11 pm on October 8th, 2008 19
#9 that post was in response to Jafo and Cloying Odor.
What I said is a fact!!!!
I’ll answer your questions anyway.
For stability and some sort of security, with contracting it here today gone tommorrow.
1. Your right, but your income is still tax free.
2. Apparently your not overseas, try LSI, Dyncor, Stanley Assoc.
3. As a DAC housing has to be a certain code, if not, you cannot rent the apartment
also has to have a fridge, washer/dryer, stove, AC and fire extinguisher. DAC’s are
authorize 18000lbs HHG. How about contractors?
3a. As a DAC every landlord in the country knows your grade and LQA rate and they will max you out. Negotiation upso.
4 Salary + per diem + retirement = toksan dollar and then of course you got the exchange rate.
6. My bad….but you can get fired on Friday, fly on Tuesday to a job in Europe, Middle East etc.
When it comes to DAC my advise to you, is to do your research. Who do you think makes the laws concerning labor?
Kormatt,
I agree with your post, except the corrupt part. I think we both know its not Command policy, but individuals.
Mcnut and others
You have 90 days to find employment with the US Government after that you are ineligible for employment IAW with the SOFA and Federal employment rules/laws. If your retiring from the military DO NOT let the government move you.
Do anybody remember Son Ju Ri, Yong Ju gol etc: on the Z? a lot guys up there had businesses(Clubs, restaurants) for years and they lost income when 2ID left. Korea is not
as cheap as we want to think. All those guys that got a hook up maybe in jam now. As for
contractors read the rules guys, when you fly from the Middle east and stay in the US for 2 weeks and then fly to Korea for work……….
I think the government decided to see how much spare change we got.