By I had an e-mail request to start a thread about LQA (Living Quarters Allowance) for US civilians working in Korea. The e-mailer made a good point about how LQA has dropped significantly this year, probably in reaction to the fluctuating Korean won, but many US civilian workers have contracts signed with landlords that are based on the old LQA rate. The local CPAC (Civilian Personnel Advisory Center) office hasn’t been any help for people in this situation and they only state that people with signed contracts may be responsible for the difference between the new LQA and their current rental agreement.
I don’t know much about LQA since I am in the military, but according to this fact sheet LQA is not an entitlement:
1. Q: What is a Living Quarters Allowance (LQA)?
A: Generally, LQA is intended to be a recruitment incentive for U.S. citizen civilian employees, living in the United States, to accept Federal employment in a foreign area. LQA covers substantially all annual costs for suitable, adequate living quarters for employee and family while living in the overseas area. However, LQA is not an entitlement or automatic salary supplement.
I take this to mean that LQA is not something that should be planned around having since it is not an entitlement. Since it is not an entitlement I’m not sure if that means the government is responsible for picking up the difference between an LQA reduction and a signed rental contract. Looking at the contract people with LQA sign, there is nothing that mentions this.
If anyone knows more details about this LQA issue please discuss in the comments section. Thanks.
5:24 am on January 5th, 2009 1
NC47,
When did they tell you that you had to pay back the difference? It seems to me that if they released the money then you are grandfathered using your 1 or 2 year contract. All new contracts and anyone renewing will get the lower rate. Being a civilian and getting LQA my money is directly deposited into my landlords account from the states. When I sat down with her we figured that as long as the exchange doesn't change more than 300 won to the dollar for the year than she will get the same amount as last time. This really only effects people who get paid in dollars or those who max the LQA rate every time.
8:09 am on January 5th, 2009 2
Thanks for the thread GI. I sat down with a rep at the Yongsan CPAC and her explanation to me is that DAC’s are paid 2 years advance on their LQA. She told me we were paid a daily rate and when the LQA rate changes DAC’s are responsible for the difference in their daily rate. For example, under the old rate I would get about $168 a day for housing, under the new rate I would get about $120 a day for housing leaving me responsible for the 48 dollars a day difference. As luck would have it I moved into my place a month before this LQA rate change took effect so if the Government goes through with collecting the difference from me I would owe them over 30K in 2 years, not exactly what I signed up for when I came to Korea.
What I don’t understand is why would they even offer it to me? Why don’t they pay in WON and alleviate all this mess? CPAC has no answer as to whether or not I will be responsible nor do they have a solution for getting out of my contract that they also agreed to. During IMF the LQA rate never fell so, why now? The figures I have heard is that more than half of DAC’s are maxed out on LQA. I also know a couple of DAC’s that have fallen under the new LQA rates and yet the CPAC continues to allow them to max out under the new rates. I really wish the CPAC would address this issue to the masses instead of not telling us anything.
7:52 am on January 5th, 2009 3
According to CPAC you are not granfathered in. When you sign paperwork for your LQA you initial a document and one of the paragraphs on that document says something to the effect that you understand you will make every attempt to spend only up to 80% of you authorized LQA allowance and may be responsible to pay the difference. I would urge all DAC's to bring this question up to CPAC if you are above the maximunm allowed daily rate. If, at the time of you received LQA, your contract exceeded the maximum allowable rate today, you may be responsoble for the difference. You not knowing this is exactly my problem with CPAC, they are not notifying the public about this and were pretty serious about the possiblity I and other may get a bill from the Government at the end of out leases.
7:53 am on January 5th, 2009 4
This is one of the few times LQA rate has changed enough to make a difference and that is probably why no one knows about this.
10:15 am on January 5th, 2009 5
If you decide that you deserve to live in a an obviuosly overpriced Korean apartment or house because you feel that "Hey, it's not my money!" then you deserve to get screwed when the LQA drops. The Koreans that rent on the basis of what you get for LQA are criminals and have been ripping off the US Government for 50+ years and if you continue to facilitate them ripping us off by maxing out your LQA then you are a douchebag.
10:38 am on January 5th, 2009 6
Cloying _oder, that's not the point but thanks for letting everyone know your beliefs. The old rate for a family with one child was $64,350 a year, the new rate for a family with one child is $47,850 a year. That means that unless you are below $47,850 a year right now then you may have to pay the difference. So if you didn't max out and spent let's say $52,000 a year then you may still be responsible for the difference. As I said before more than half of DAC's are maxed out under the old rate and just about everyone is above the new rate.
10:48 am on January 5th, 2009 7
Why blame Koreans for the LQA rate when they have nothing to do with setting it? The State Department Office of Allowances sets the rates, and the military Housing Office approves the amount of rent paid for a particular apartment. It only makes sense that the Korean / Italian / German landlords, as businessmen and women, would charge as much as they can.
11:23 am on January 5th, 2009 8
Rob, I agree with that. If I or anyone else owned a house they would rent it out for as much as possible. In the States, Americans that own holmes around Military Bases rent their homes out to service members for the max allowed, what business man wouldn't?
11:42 am on January 5th, 2009 9
My point is that your Korean landlord is charging you, the weaguk, $5400.00 a month for real estate that a Korean would only be paying half as much for if that. In fact the Korean would put the 65k down when he moves in, pay little or no monthly rent and then recover his 65k when his lease was up. The fact of the matter is that if the LQA funds were actually your HARD EARNED money their is no way in hell you would be paying $5400.00 a month for your house or apartment.
As long as the people in the housing office (who approve the rates… hmm… funny that)on Yongson continue to recieve kickbacks from the landlords (and actually many of them are the landlords themselves) they will continue to illegally fix housing prices for US Government civilians and continue to rip off the US taxpayer.
12:03 pm on January 5th, 2009 10
This conversation is heading towards Julie's Realty territory:
http://rokdrop.com/2008/03/06/details-of-yongsan-…
The housing scam would end if people were allowed to pocket what LQA is left over after signing a housing contract.
12:05 pm on January 5th, 2009 11
Odor is right. I was non-command sponsored and therefore lived in an apartment building with mostly USFK NCOs. I found out that they were paying their max OHA for the same apartment I was paying my max OHA for.
How can an identical apartment cost thousands more per month?
Then I had to pay $800 out of my pocket when I moved out before the realtor would sign my clearing papers due to "over utilities." I doubt Koreans pay "over utilities."
12:51 pm on January 5th, 2009 12
Oh, it's most definitely a scam, and isn't quite fair when compared to what a Korean would pay for a comperable apartment either, but I still think the majority of the blame falls on the military housing office and State Department. The Koreans are going to charge what they can, just like any businessman of any nationality would do.
Like black marketing, it is controllable, but for some reason nobody wants to do anything about it.
2:01 pm on January 5th, 2009 13
I agree with all the statements here, I would add that if you move before the lease is up, your screwed because the landlord will say he did get the 30 day notice. Guess who pays the money back.
For the folks that are going to Korea DO NOT let her control the process, she cannot sign the paperwork….if something goes wrong its on you, not her. Even though it his/er country they have nothing to do with LQA.
Cloying_Odor is correct you will pay 1 1/2 to triple the rate a Korean will. Americans don't charge by grade for the same real estate like overseas landlords do.
@#2
That statement about LQA being deposited from a stateside account does not sound right. You could find yourself in a jam.
2:27 pm on January 5th, 2009 14
Here is a good reason why you don't fool around with LQA.
http://www.mspb.gov/netsearch/viewdocs.aspx?docnu…
4:41 pm on January 5th, 2009 15
I concur and GI you are partially right. I would institute a program where if any unused housing money were left over, the individual would pocket half the difference and the government would keep the other half.
So:
50,000 LQA
Talk the landlord down to 30,000
Individual keeps 10,000
Gov't keeps 10,000
This would give incentive for individuals not to max out their LQA AND save the government some money…
4:55 pm on January 5th, 2009 16
My Korean wife negotiated the rent on my previous apartment and never mentioned to the landlord that she was married to a weaguk. They signed the paperwork and she gave the deposit with the agreed monthly rent of w350,000 then they went to have coffee at a coffee shop. During the talk the landlord says "I am married to an American Army officer" (nevermind the violation of SOFA status going on here.. he he) to which my wife says "Well, actually I am married to an American as well". My wife says the landlord had a rage attack and actually yelled profanity at her in hangul and proceeded to actually say "you should be paying w1,000,000 per month then". Well too bad the lease was already signed… needless to say we did not get a renewel after our 2 years were up.
The American who lived in the building next to mine in an identical appartment was paying $2300.00 a month in dollars and he thought he had a good deal until I filled him in. I could provide examples of this for days but it just gets my blood pressure up.
If we add up all the money that these people have fleeced from the US taxpayer in the last 57 years I bet it would cover the 700 Billion dollar bailout and we would still have enough left over to buy a few B-2 bombers as well.
We need to pull out of here just like we did in the PI!!! Do it and Do it now.
5:21 pm on January 5th, 2009 17
I agree, I always had my (Korean) wife not mention my nationality whenever she made ANY transaction. Now, I'm at a disadvantage but have been here long enough to manage.
There is no need to pull out, just stop feeding the cat…
11:12 pm on January 5th, 2009 18
What in the world????
Some people are complaining even though they are getting over 50k USD in housing a year!!!! Dude – if you were livin gin the States, you would be paying rent/mortgage out of your own pocket! If you are complaining of returning a few thousand dollars because fo a won adjustment… then what the heck are you doing with yoru money? juicy girl expense???
12:14 am on January 6th, 2009 19
Leon good point. Half of whatever is saved would be a better idea. I have been wondering for years why this isn't done, but I have my suspicions why.
1:41 am on January 6th, 2009 20
#19, civilians get Cost Of Living Allowance (COLA) in the States, I was getting 19.8% where I just came from. I knew several officers that lived in the same housing complex and they were maxed out on their housing expense so it isn't only in Korea, American landlords do the same thing. Do any of you who are complaining about Koreans ripping off the Government own your own house and rent it out? Do you try to get the max out of renting the house out or do you get less just to be a good guy? These landlords do exactly what you would do if you were renting out a house, and if you wouldn't do what they are doing, well then you aren't very smart.
5:54 am on January 6th, 2009 21
#9: There is no where in the greater Yongsan area where you can get an apartment with only $65K key money – even for Koreans. If you can read Korean, you can read it on the windows of any real estate office in town. Key money for a decent sized apartment will easily go over 400,000,000 won.
6:36 am on January 6th, 2009 22
I’m an O4 with dependents and currently am only getting $928/month including utilities for Uijeongbu, so I have no sympathy either.
8:49 am on January 6th, 2009 23
If you are a DAC and you received housing money before OCT 08 it would be in your best interest to ask CPAC, and in area II there is only one lady to ask, if you are over the allowable amount. This LQA rate drop may effect anyone over the new amount set in Oct 08. CPAC isn’t going to notify you or give you any info without you asking and you may find that at the end of your lease you get an IOU from Uncle Sam.
10:56 am on January 28th, 2009 24
One thing you could do, is to pay your utilities out of pocket, don't let the landlord pay the utilities. When you do your reconciliation that money comes back to youPay the landlord the rent money, in dollars, not won.
12:22 am on June 30th, 2009 25
What happens if you pay too much on utilities and at the end of your contract have a 1mil won SURPLUS balance (beause you are thrifty or sleep over at the gf's apt,etc)
Do GI's get utilitites back if they overpay?
I see no statements to prohibit this common sense logic. If your over on your utitlies, you can be dam sure your Korean landlord is going to collect it.
8:27 am on August 9th, 2009 26
Its best not to let the landlord pay any of your major utilities (healing / electricity / management fee). You want to see the bills yourself and manage them on your own. Also if you live in an older apartment building, or a villa, check your electricity box at least once a week to see if the land lord put in an "extra" line to their house. Those bastards will do that so they can you to pay for part of their electricity.
And the biggest piece of advice I can give is to get a Korean (coworker or Wife) to assist you in finding a place to live. Get a place away from the base that is rented to Koreans and make sure you check the local prices before you let them "set" a price for you.
This is how I ended up getting a 42 pyong apartment for 1.15 mil won a month, when the guys near the base are paying 1.3 mil for a 33 pyong, and 2mil+ if their a GS. This is in Daegu.
9:05 am on August 19th, 2009 27
I recently agreed to serve in Korea and was informed that I would get $43,500 a year in LQA. So I can't keep ANY of it?
I'll be based in Seoul/Yongsan. Where should I look to move for a REASONABLE rent? New Jersey?????
10:49 am on August 19th, 2009 28
Julies Realty will hook you up. You might even get a reach around.
2:45 pm on August 19th, 2009 29
Didn't they JUST get unbanned from Area II for fraud? I want to work NOT go to jail.
4:20 pm on August 19th, 2009 30
Oh no. They have realized the error in their ways. They'll never pull anything like that again. I'm certain they are honest as the day is long! They've truly learned their lesson and seen the light.
Besides, they were only off limits in Area II so they couldn't have done anything THAT bad, right?
Julie Baek is pure as the driven snow. It was all just a misunderstanding.