By The annual bust of one high profile USFK blackmarketing scheme has been announced:
Almost $8 million in goods were stolen from Camp Stanley over the course of a year in an alleged black market operation, leading to the indictments last week of six South Koreans.
Five of the people indicted are former Army and Air Force Exchange Service employees, officials said.
Oh Won-geun of the Seoul Supreme Prosecutors Office said Friday that between October 2005 and September 2006 the group rang up fraudulent receipts to cover the smuggling of a variety of goods — including electronic equipment and alcoholic beverages — from Camp Stanley outside Uijeongbu. The goods were primarily sold at the Namdaemun market in Seoul.
In all, the group stole about 8,000 items costing 9.8 billion won, or more than $7.8 million, he said.
“It was a very organized ring,” Oh said.
Some of those indicted for violating the Customs Act are cooperating with authorities; the investigation into the alleged smuggling ring is continuing.
Area I AAFES General Manager Ken Limtiaco, who was not in his current job when the alleged smuggling ring was in operation, said the investigation that led to the indictments was prompted by a “spot check” that turned up goods being smuggled out of Camp Stanley, he said. [Stars & Stripes]
Read the rest of the article for the full story, but these indictments come from a case that occurred three years ago. When the Camp Long PX was busted for blackmarketing I actually speculated about how much money the larger PX’s were making annually due to blackmarketing. Now we know it is about $8 million a year. If the Camp Stanley PX was making that much in a year blackmarketing just think what the Yongsan and Osan PX’s are making? I bet it is easily over $10 million a year.
Is it any wonder why the AAFES employees black market when there is this much money to be made? Additionally the punishments if you are caught are so light the black marketers really have very little to lose and a whole lot to gain. For example the manger of the Camp Long PX received a year in jail, but since he has been black marketing for years he is most likely a millionaire now. A store employee at Camp Long received only a 10 month suspended sentence. Who knows how much money he saved up during his time black marketing?
Now I am wondering when they will investigate the Camp Stanley Commissary for blackmarketing as well?
5:47 am on July 21st, 2009 1
There's no reason to even bring this subject up. The BM has been going on for 60 years and nobody has even tried to do something about it. Sure, there will be insignificant measures taken but nothing that will significantly cut into business as usual.
AAFES and DECA make HUGE money off the Black market, they have no incentive to try and curtail it. If you ever see anyone get into real trouble then you'll know that's when the u.s. is about to bow out and leave the Peninsula. Which, given the financial disaster that's facing the u.s. should be within 5 years.
6:36 am on July 21st, 2009 2
No one makes money off of the black market when AAFES employees are making inventory disappear from shelves and storerooms. And I'd say that someone is apparently trying to do something about it, since they now scan my ID card every time I buy a fricking Mars bar.
7:15 am on July 21st, 2009 3
Hmm. they're FINALLY starting to scan ID's. Something big is about to happen.
8:38 am on July 21st, 2009 4
Well, there goes my retirement plan!!
9:07 am on July 21st, 2009 5
The current policy of scanning IDs for all purchases and the old policy of ID scans for the purchase of ration controlled items only attempts to address the problem at the tail end; the point of retail purchase.
Everyone has always known that the real black marketing occurs long before products turn up on retail shelves. It occurs in the shipping ports, during transport, and in the warehouses.
Adequate inventory control technology has existed for decades with direct to database barcode scanning. Embedded RFIDs of the last decade would have provided a means to detect the loss of millions of dollars of products from a small outlet over a 3 year period. Ask FedEx or DHL how it's done.
If they are falsifying sales receipts to account for products going out the warehouse back door, those receipts should have to represent actual money in the till. How could an inventory and sales management system not recognize the shortfall?
Why are AAFES and DECA employees still using pen and paper ledgers to record product movement and transactions?
AAFES, DECA and USFK seemed to have been in collusion to delay the implementation of these technologies, while pretending retail end scanning of ration and ID cards were the best deterrence available against black marketing.
10:01 am on July 21st, 2009 6
Hu, how does AAFES and DeCA profit from black marketing?
10:01 am on July 21st, 2009 7
I know a lot of Koreans around this base went into immediate panic mode once they found out the ID scans were coming. All the crass Ajumas and other black marketeers were buying as much product as they could before the ID checking went into effect.
I was even approached by panicky Koreans to get them some of the more common BM items. One thing about Koreans, they're intensely greedy and have absolutely no concept of patience. I'm just a little nobody and the stuff I see these people do is insane.
10:05 am on July 21st, 2009 8
I don't think scanning the ID's would have affected the smugglers (didn't I read somewhere that they dug a tunnel out of Yongsan for smuggling beer and alcohol?), but it will probably reduce the amount of beef being bought and sold illegally.
10:08 am on July 21st, 2009 9
Write your congressman. There are two ways to curb black marketing in the ROK. Either have all US Citizens as employees of AAFES and DeCA in the ROK or get rid of AAFES and DeCA. When an American Citizen steals from AAFES or especially DeCA, they are prosecuted under US jurisdiction. There is seldom any mercy for thieves in US Federal Court. The only other way to get rid of BM is to get rid of the commissary and aafes, then you'll just have the military equipment to deal with. Either way, Koreans are sterotyped by many as greedy, conniving, thieves and this is another reason that sterotype continues.
10:15 am on July 21st, 2009 10
Tead – It is my belief this "scanning" measure came from AAFES headquarters in Texas. They probably have been waiting for a long time to implement this. This is the only way of inventory control feesable, at least for now. This places the burden on the AAFES Korea General Manager. There is no way for the employees to fradulently purchase without scanning an ID card. When crap starts disappearing they can look at the manager for answers. Black marketing will always continue in the ROK, I don't care if GEN Sharp came out and said anyone caught will be executed, Koreans are thieves and thats the bottom line. (Someone prove me wrong about that "Koreans are thieves" thing.)
10:22 am on July 21st, 2009 11
If they ever wanted to curb or stop black marketing they could easily do it. It's really a shame they punish the military folks for petty crap while the thieving Koreans get away with murder. However, that's just part of the price the u.s. has to pay for having a small presence on the Asian continent.
10:45 am on July 21st, 2009 12
The make money because they sell more. Helllluuuurrrrrrrrr. 15 years ago when they implemented the SSN system for the commissary, the FIRST day sales dropped from $140K per day to $70K per day. Did everyone start eating less in 1 day?
If your were DECA and making 5% of sales, would you rather have 5% of $140K or 5% of $70K?
11:14 am on July 21st, 2009 13
They are stereotyped as such because, well, where there is smoke there is fire.
Another cultural difference- something about these folks which equates all of the illegal activity with "getting over" or just getting a bargain. In their mind, it's only bad if you get caught. It's clever and worthy of congratulations if you can pull off a scam.
Our allies.
11:16 am on July 21st, 2009 14
That's childish. Who wouldn't try to make some money off this over-bloated inefficient war-machine? If the U.S. military supply system can't get its house in order, it deserves to get filched from. I bet if some adjumma was running the show, there wouldn't be 8 mil walking out the door.
12:06 pm on July 21st, 2009 15
I agree with Lemmy, we need American citizens running AAFES. Also, there should be no Koreans working on post except as low level labor.
12:36 pm on July 21st, 2009 16
"Write your congressman". Wow, now there's a new idea. (I remember the same idea from 30 years ago).
I suspect congress has long ago written off black marketing in South Korea as business as usual. Its understood as part of doing business in South Korea. Don't ask don't tell applies. (or perhaps,'yes, we already know, and have known for a long time.')
There are no votes to be gained by stiring the waters, yet, much money in political donations and many votes to be gained for the well being of Korean/American relations. Not to mention administration kudos for not mentioning it.
The idiology of "its only a crime if you get caught, and worthy of congradulations if you can pull it off" has been around for longer than I can remember, and I remember back at least 40 years.
1:13 pm on July 21st, 2009 17
Koreans do plenty of jobs other than low level labor. That's just demeaning.
Besides, KN wages are paid by Korea. That saves the US money.
The problem is stuff goes out the front door and back door, and always will because Koreans want the goods. Why is there no ration system in Germany or Japan? Because the goods aren't in demand.
1:50 pm on July 21st, 2009 18
Bingo. Get Americans into at least the mid-level manager positions, everywhere. AAFES make MORE than enough to afford paying them fairly as well.
Bottom line: Most BM takes place long before the point of sale and yet USFK continues to harass regular everyday customers. BM adjima you see on post is less than 1/10th of 1% of the broad BM problem. Scanning ID cards, pfft. Must be that "show everyone we are 'doing something' mentality."
2:15 pm on July 21st, 2009 19
Well, that's a bit racist, don't you think?
The only thing my wife ever stole is my heart.
2:17 pm on July 21st, 2009 20
What about Americans? You don't develop the largest economy in the world without stepping on someone's back, you know.
4:14 pm on July 21st, 2009 21
It is, a bit "racist", but remember- we're dealing with a fairly homogeneous culture where getting over is considered clever and ingenious- LOTS of reasons for this, and from history, some are pretty understandable. BUT– That doesn't help the contemporary issue. Anytime you have two cultures which aren't exactly congruent or complimentary in their attributes meeting up, you are going to have problems like this- Africa, Middle East, even with some peoples who populate North America! It is unavoidable, so going in, you have to understand what you are dealing with to minimize these issues from the get go.
We are pretty much reaping what we have sown, in a system which is set up for all kinds of abuse. Of course, GI Joe going a few bottles over his limit at the start or end of the month to cover a BBQ gets slammed.
I was at the commissary this week and saw two hooker looking dependents stocking up on ox tails and other high demand goodies. Profiling on my part? Perhaps. Racist on my part? Yeah- maybe. But they looked and acted guilty and kept looking over their shoulders. It was kinda funny. And while the empire falls apart, I have very little concern about what labels someone puts on me… They have lost their "punch" because they are part of a liberal mantra to defend the indefensible and excuse the inexcusable.
No- I didn't call the cops or anything like that. I have been here long enough to know how much good THAT would have done.
6:21 pm on July 21st, 2009 22
What does a "hooker looking dependent" look like? Is it that she is fairly young and attractive?
7:00 pm on July 21st, 2009 23
Right, because Americans never try to do one over onto others, right?
So, when are you going to write to your congressman to urge him or her to have all the treaties signed with Natives respected?
8:57 pm on July 21st, 2009 24
your comment is exactly why thieving perpetuates in Korea. Its like telling someone "its your own fault your car was stolen"
I have more respect for someone who kills people than I do for someone who steals or lies.
9:04 pm on July 21st, 2009 25
I guess you didn't write your cogressman 30 years ago just like you didn't write them now. I hope your not condoning thievery, but you write like you are.
I don't have to think back 40 years, my parents explained to me that stealing and lying are wrong. I understood them. It does not confuse me as to why some Servicemembers morals and values are so low, it is simply a product of their upbringing. Its too bad that they drag those same morals and values with them into the ranks of our armed forces.
I would never congratulate someone who stole something of mine, I would do what ever I could to kill that person. Again, I have more respect for a murderer than a thief or a liar.
9:10 pm on July 21st, 2009 26
BLUF: write your congressman, senator, or the President in order to piss people off. What else can you do to GEN Sharp or LTG Fil, send them a letter? They won't do anything and they certainly don't have to answer to you. They do have to answer to members of both houses and the Pesident.
You seem to be missing the point. The point of writing congress is to draw negative attention to Korea, USFK, and AAFES. Having congress investigate you is never plesant and it tends to piss people off. When that happens, people are held accountable for their actions and they are fired. Seeing the person you are replacing get fired tends to send a message. Sorry I have to paint a picture.
9:40 pm on July 21st, 2009 27
I don't know why everyone is getting so defensive on this subject. It is not hurting America, we enforce it because it is in the SOFA agreement. About 13 years ago the MP's monitored black marketing occuring in the PX using the security system cameras on the ceiling of the PX. There were 12 Korean ladies monitored over a weeks time purchasing a combined $120,000 worth of goods. The story made the front page of the stars and stripes and as a result the PX lost millions in revenue due to BM's being scared away.
As a result of all this, the expansion of the Yongsan PX was delayed several years. MWR received it's lowest contribution from AAFES ever and the general who was assigned to AAFES in the states became involved with base leaders. AAFES stance on the situation was what you would expect….THEY PAY THEY STAY, IT IS NOT AAFES RESPONSIBLITY TO MONITOR BMing….
When we stop money from pooring into the Military bases like curbing BMing or restricting KN's from playing slot machines it only hurts the Soldiers on the base. We do these things because it is in the SOFA agreement…I mean…think about it…. when someone blackmarkets OX tails the butcher off base is loosing out, the commissary made it's money off the sale….
9:43 pm on July 21st, 2009 28
Fairly young and attractive in a naughty way- the kind of girl you would only bring home to Mom if you wanted Mom to have a coronary on the spot.
Make up, tight and somewhat revealing clothing, mesh/net stuff. Well executed. The heels were a nice touch!
Yeah- one was the lead, the other was "dash one"… The lead was, well, fairly hot. The other was doing her best to follow her lead… but just didn't have her heart into it.
9:46 pm on July 21st, 2009 29
It's actually kinda funny- My only b!tch is when the PX says that they are out of something. No kidding- order more. Order more to cover the stuff you "lose" at the dock or on the way to the retail outlet. When you run out of razor blades or cold medicine or something you KNOW the BM ajumas are going to be buying cartloads of, order more. Simple.
10:33 pm on July 21st, 2009 30
Lemmy,
Since we're painting pictures…I was replying to Junior's comment, not yours.
10:37 pm on July 21st, 2009 31
I've been to the PX in Yongsan. Everything seemed cheaper than what it costs back home. I can't imagine that they are turning a large profit, if any at all, when you factor in the overhead.
10:45 pm on July 21st, 2009 32
The reason to fight blackmarketing is because like many things in Korea it breeds corruption just like the on-post gambling did. Additionally why should some ajumma at the PX become a millionaire due to these BM and gambling schemes while Joe is in the motoropool working his ass off all day for far less just to go to the PX/commissary and find items he wants not in stock?
11:06 pm on July 21st, 2009 33
Blackmarketing is run much like the MOB, there are people at the top who funnel the money down to the ladies who actually do the shopping so it isn't a few ajuma's at the PX getting rich. The reason for shelves being empty isn't due to blackmarketing it is poor management. Blackmarketing is pretty steady from week to week, AAFES isn't good at supply and demand is all. Blackmarketing is not a big deal to USFK, they enforce it because they have to, that is why violators get a slap on the wrist and are right back at it a week later. In all my time as an MP I saw one family member sent back to the states because of blackmarketing and that is because her husband requested it. I have seen things in and around blackmarketing from people of influence on Yongsan that would give folks a better understanding of just how serious USFK takes blackmarketing on the paninsula… I can only say they don't take it serious at all because if they could… they would not enforce any blackmarketing laws, they do it because it is in the SOFA agreement and that is it…
11:21 pm on July 21st, 2009 34
BMCOM,
"It is not hurting America, we enforce it because it is in the SOFA agreement."
I'm not sure if this is absolutely correct. Someone kindly correct me where I am wrong.
I believe all salaries, transportation costs, utilities (and maybe building costs) are payed for by the taxpayer. Maybe other things as well.
This means that every time a $200 bottle of alcohol, an ox tail or a 50 pound bag of rice doesn't go to its intended purpose (taking care of GIs), AAFES makes some money but the taxpayer loses… as do the guys who need better equipment in the field, the guys who need long-term care for war-related injuries and the guys who put their arse on the line every day for less than they could make as… as… as an AAFES manager.
The MWR donation for cheerleaders and fishing trips isn't really as necessary as it seems in comparison to other priorities.
I have no idea of the actual equation that governs these transactions… so please correct me if I am mistaken… but the repeated excuse of "money is being made" doesn't ring true in the big picture… meaning that after transportation, storage and sales infrastructure, it may be a net loss for America…
…although it is a net gain, politically and sometimes financially, for whoever is in charge.
Any thoughts on this line of reasoning from those of you better informed?
11:27 pm on July 21st, 2009 35
****repeated excuse of “money is being made” doesn’t ring true in the big picture***
You could replace the above quotes with "are payed for by the taxpayer"… Blackmarketing in Korea would make no difference on how much you pay in taxes.
11:30 pm on July 21st, 2009 36
We spend far more on policing BMing then the salaries, transportation costs, utilities, etc… associated with BMing…
12:06 am on July 22nd, 2009 37
So you mean to say you have no problem with the Camp Long PX guy making millions or ajummas like this making millions simply because it is to inconvenient to crackdown on them:
http://rokdrop.com/2005/03/24/korean-woman-earns-…
Is that the same logic that allows the realty to keep going on as well? This all breeds corruption which is what the SSRT scandal showed everyone. This all ultimately ends up screwing soldiers.
12:23 am on July 22nd, 2009 38
The fact that DECA sells Ox tail and Kalbi (In EXTREMELY large amounts)are PROOF that DECA is a black market organization. I had a friend who worked on base who read an email from a DECA chief saying "Do NOT let Kalbi run out of stock before Chu-Sok!"
My only complaint is the horribly disgusting nasty Ajuma's. Did someone marry them and that's how they get access to the Commissary/PX? Who the fwuck would marry someone so despicable? So crass. I can't even be near them as they take stuff off the shelves and throw them in their carts in the most loud, rude and selfish way. These people are not human, they're some sort of bastardized version between a rogue wild animal and severely retarded humans.
12:24 am on July 22nd, 2009 39
If it wasn't in the SOFA there would be nothing to enforce. The only reason anyone is profitting and/or it breads corruption is because it is written in the SOFA agreement. Do you think the US really cares about this? take a step back and understand why it is enforced and what would happen if there were no laws against blackmarketing… I am not for blackmarketing…. I worked in policing it for many years… I think people need to understand why it is enforced and the benefits of opening or flooding the markets…
12:37 am on July 22nd, 2009 40
BMing doesn't effect soldiers either…it is like getting a speeding ticket or getting caught with a joint in the States…it is a small infraction in USFK's eyes. There are much more important things the MP's could spend their time doing but instead they spend countless hours on filinf reports and checking ID cards at the slot machine rooms. It is really pathetic that we worry about such petty things in Korea that have a negative effect when enforced. When blackmarketing was easier to get away with back in the 70's, 80's and early 90's there was far less crime on base than there is now so don't use the excuse it breads other crimes… People have just been programmed to believe it is a big deal when in fact it isn't…
2:25 am on July 22nd, 2009 41
BMCOP is a sucker.
He has bought into whatever corrupt system he has been brainwashed into enforcing… as a "Black Marketing COP".
For example…
"Blackmarketing in Korea would make no difference on how much you pay in taxes."
The problem isn't that this is YOUR excuse for fraud, waste and abuse. The problem is that this is EVERYBODY's excuse for fraud, waste and abuse.
"We spend far more on policing BMing then the salaries, transportation costs, utilities, etc… associated with BMing…"
I believe you spend it. I don't believe you police it. If that were the case, there would be no black marketing.
"BMing doesn’t effect soldiers either"
Then why are certain in-demand items always out of stock.
"…it is like getting a speeding ticket or getting caught with a joint in the States…it is a small infraction in USFK’s eyes."
As long as the golf buddies are hookin' up "leadership". Go be GI Joe and exceed your limits.
"There are much more important things the MP’s could spend their time doing but instead they spend countless hours on filinf reports and checking ID cards at the slot machine rooms."
And those important things are __________.
Don't try to confuse taxpayer-subsidized black marketing with ajuma pisssing money away on the slots.
"People have just been programmed to believe it is a big deal when in fact it isn’t…"
No. People think it is a big deal while they are trying to be programmed that it isn't.
Go suck a dicck, BMCOP.
2:47 am on July 22nd, 2009 42
The biggest problem I have with the whole BM enforcement scheme is that a Korean can get away with making millions of dollars off selling stuff downtown while a PFC or E-4 (or anyone else who accidentally or through ignorance) goes one bottle over their limit, one time, is crucified. That my friends is bullshit.
Selective enforcement and oversight is one problem. The fact that AAFES obviously (or states they do not) have any form of inventory control mechanism more modern than the methods utilized in the 1600's is inexcusable.
Chickenhead is right, and one thing I will constantly preach; almost all evil and misdeeds on installations can be directly or indirectly linked back to the WONDERFUL (I got filtered the first time) golf courses. Like it or not, this is a well known and an often rediscovered truth. GOOD NEIGHBORS indeed.
3:24 am on July 22nd, 2009 43
"If it wasn’t in the SOFA there would be nothing to enforce. The only reason anyone is profitting and/or it breads corruption is because it is written in the SOFA agreement."
The SOFA exists to bridge the difference between the Korean and American systems of justice and economics. Black marketing comes under the economic disparities. SOFA status grants tax exemptions which includes exemptions from Korean customs and duties.
Have you ever wondered why its taking so long for Korea and the U.S. to conclude a free trade agreement? On the Korean side there are powerful special interests that want to protect domestic markets by maintaining high import tariff fees on competing import products. That was a large part of what the mad cow protests were about last year.
So the SOFA is not the cause of profiteering and corruption. If you open the AAFES and DeCA stores for unrestricted access to the Koreans and the SOFA store shelves would be immediately wiped clean. We would also have massive Korean protests at the gates for undermining their domestic markets.
3:47 am on July 22nd, 2009 44
Now that they are scanning ID cards every time a purchase is made, I would think there shouldn't be any more accidental over-purchasing of alcohol – right? Or does having the system set up so that it won't allow over-purchasing make too much sense?
Someone said something about there not being a demand for BM goods in Japan. That sure wasn't the case when I was stationed there. There were black marketers who would literally go from base to base – hitting every PX, BX, shoppette and commissary along the way – and literally fill a van up to the top of the roof. And they would do this day-in and day-out.
7:08 am on July 22nd, 2009 45
Back at you chickenhead, you whine like a B!TCH… I haven't been an MP for years, I don't pay attention to little adjumas running around the PX and commissary BMing, maybe that is why I couldn't give a sh!t what they are doing. BMing is only a big deal to people who are misinformed or just generaly pissed off at life and by the looks of your posts you are both. I mean, Sh!t, you have probably blackmarketed according to the law, blackmarketing isn't just purchasing and selling AAFES and commissary goods. Do you even know what the laws are on blackmarketing? I am guessing you think it is OK to purchase a bottle of alcohol as a gift for a Korean or buy some food, cook it, and leave the leftovers, well… in the BS law that is BMing that is BMing…so get over it, we do it so the Korean don't loose money on the outside not because it hurts us on base.
9:07 am on July 22nd, 2009 46
In theory you have a stock age level and order more BEFORE you run out. Kinda like shop stock in a direct support shop. Tracking trends to determine approximately how much you sell a month is also helpful but this type of "management" seems to escape many of the folks who run DECA and AAFES in Korea. I'm guessing we don't have the A team over here.
9:36 am on July 22nd, 2009 47
I was just in Okinawa and there was no ration system. In fact, you can sign in guests to the PX! So if there is black marketing, then no one cares.
In Germany they don't even have ration cards.
So the real question is: who in Korea is driving it? It has to be the Korean government because obviously the U.S. just doesn't care unless the local government wants it enforced.
9:39 am on July 22nd, 2009 48
Some of you guys are missing the point of BMCOP's thoughts. I would say that 90% of the stuff that's being BM, GI's don't buy…the oxtails and kalbi packs are good examples. What's bought is microwave and quick fix foods. As mentioned, the problems are at the docks and warehouses, not at the commissary, where the products are paid for.
As far as game rooms go, when they figure out a surefire way to fix the cashiers, the id card check will go away.
10:18 am on July 22nd, 2009 49
Marcus, this just shows how greedy and corrupt all layers of Korean society is. Think of them as cheaper versions of Japanese and a little cleaner than mainlander Chinese.
If they didn't have ration control in that shite of a country it really would be out of control, even more than it is already. When you get on the continent of Asia it really is an alien world. Human rights, courtesies, politeness, humility..all that goes out the window. It's all lies, thieving, and robbing others in Asia.
12:11 pm on July 22nd, 2009 50
bmcop,
"Back at you chickenhead"
Well… uh… I didn't mean MY diick.
"I don’t pay attention to little adjumas running around the PX and commissary BMing,"
Nor, it seems, does anybody else that should… maybe because they are slackers or they are in on the scam… or maybe they have bought into the unconvincing line that "black marketing is GOOD for America!"
"BMing is only a big deal to people who are misinformed or just generaly pissed off at life"
Then stop yapping about everything else and kindly inform us how organized black marketing benefits the United States… how the profit put back into the taxpayer's pocket is greater than the expense, how the culture of corruption encouraged by semi-open black marketing assists in efficient completion of the missions, how a large inventory of black market-targeted items doesn't take away from items that GI Joe wants to buy… etc.
Inform us and we will stop whining… and being "pissed off"… although "irritated" is a better word… as, after a while, shills rationalizing the benefits of corruption around USFK do become irritating and are worthy only of ridicule and disrespect.
"I mean, Sh!t, you have probably blackmarketed according to the law, blackmarketing isn’t just purchasing and selling AAFES and commissary goods. Do you even know what the laws are on blackmarketing? I am guessing you think it is OK to purchase a bottle of alcohol as a gift for a Korean or buy some food, cook it, and leave the leftovers, well… in the BS law that is BMing that is BMing…so get over it,"
Unbelievable. First you try to compare the black marketing of taxpayer-subsidized items with slot machines. Now you try to confuse the issues of GI Joe leaving leftover food to someone who helped him (ergo, helped America) and organized rings of criminals ripping off America and bringing another layer of corruption to the already-shady dealings of USFK management.
One common theme in your writing is that GI Joe is bad but rings of ajumas and wholesale black marketers are no big deal… which must be the institutionalized thinking because the blinding selective enforcement is obvious and unhidden.
Perhaps GI Joe hooking up a helpful ajushi with a bottle of whiskey doesn't give as many white envelopes on the golf course as the guy in charge of the Ajuma Shopping Club or the guy who owns the truck being loaded up in the wee hours of the morning.
In the end, there was a lot of talk… but, as you sidestepped the direct questions and attempted to confuse the issues, you are completely unconvincing about the glorious benefits of organized black marketing.
It seems the corrupt elements of USFK has been getting sucked for a long, long time.
12:51 pm on July 22nd, 2009 51
You don't need to be a mathmatician to understand the more money coming in the more the profits. AAFES and DECA are American owned the last time I checked and the more money they make the more facilities they build and maintain. If the PX expansion wasn't already far into the planning stage in 1996 it probably would have been delayed for years. Why are you so worried about items being baught and sold off post? Stop trying to sound intelligent oxtailhead, it's not working for you…
Stop being an id!ot and read for yourself how the more money taken in means more for soldiers…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_and_Air_Force_E…
2:03 pm on July 22nd, 2009 52
BMCOP,
Once again, you are attempting to cloud issues. AAFES and DeCA are not the same thing and are not run in the same way. We can discuss AAFES-style black marketing another time.
Here are some commissary facts for 2008 according to DeCA.
There were 5,813,200,000 in sales in 2008.
"Goods are sold at cost, plus a five percent surcharge to the total to pay for building new commissaries, maintenance, and operations equipment."
These sales generated no profit. If fact, they were specifically designed not to. They were designed to save the customer 31.1% (2008) over stores that do sell for a profit. (We can debate that magic number another time).
So, if there is no profit, where does the money come from to refrigerate ox tails, bag up ajuma's purchases and ship heavy sacks of rice to Asia for resale on the black market?
There was 1,522,000,000 in taxpayer funding appropriated by Congress in 2008. (It was upped to 1,588,000,000 in 2009 based in a projected sales increase.)
That's right. For every dollar's worth that DeCA sells, it cost the taxpayer 26 cents. That's an average. Commissaries in the States cost less and places like Korea cost more.
Now, all factual-like, tell me again how moving more products to the black market, that cost at least 26 cents on the dollar to sell, means more money for soldiers.
3:39 pm on July 22nd, 2009 53
Wow, this is an historical article on black marketing….
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,…
7:34 pm on July 22nd, 2009 54
BMCOP,
You need to be deprogrammed from the happy place that those AFN commercials have sent you and realize the truth.
8:37 am on July 23rd, 2009 55
With people like BMCOP combating BM, is there any wonder??
10:43 am on July 23rd, 2009 56
Awful quiet in the peanut gallery, BMCOP.
Like all USFK apologists, bent on rationalizing open corruption, lack of transparency, arbitrary actions and selective enforcement, BMCOP has gotten much more quiet when faced with facts.
I propose that BMCOP was a poor cop in his MP days… both in his attitude and the actions that arose from it.
And, almost without a doubt, in whatever he is doing now, he is a paycheck player… doing whatever is easiest for himself while putting little or no effort in doing what is right for America or its military.
Sometimes I wonder if this is not the majority within USFK… especially the farther up you go.
This all doesn't take a great leap of intuition to surmise.
It is the normal characteristic of those who lack facts and ignore direct question yet angrily try to convince everyone that a turd can be picked up by the clean end.
11:14 am on July 23rd, 2009 57
If they can curb the theft out the back door with tighter inventory controls, any increase in costs would likely be offset.
2:54 pm on July 23rd, 2009 58
It doesn't matter what my response is… you are ignorant to this subject… you will just continue to bash people who don't agree with the way you think. You try to convince these readers that I am somehow a bad employee now and was a bad cop because I dont agree with you… grow up my friend. When I read stories on this site and see your replies they are for the most part off the mark because you think you are being whitty and convincing readers you don't even know that I am somehow the scum of the earth because I don't agree with your point.
3:04 pm on July 23rd, 2009 59
The problem with what you were saying is suggesting that it would be all good if we stopped trying to prevent black marketing. There would be no real consequence. That simply isn't true.
If we did that, service members would be deprived of necessities because the shelves would be bare and the SOFA tax exemption status would be jeopardized because we would be flooding the Korean economy with duty free items.
4:29 pm on July 23rd, 2009 60
BMCOP,
"It doesn’t matter what my response is…"
It certainly does. You have ample opportunity to counter my statements with something more than baseless proclamations and repeated claims that I don't know what I am talking about.
You have not answered a single direct question. You have not presented any fact that counters the evidence and conclusions I have posted.
Your point of view, and you, cannot be taken at all seriously until you address the issue head-on.
"you are ignorant to this subject"
That may well be. My earlier posts were based on my impression of the situation. My later posts were based on research concluding that it COSTS taxpayers 26.18 cents for every dollar that DeCA sells… likely more in Korea.
If you believe I am ignorant, educate me. Tell me exactly why this conclusion is wrong.
"You try to convince these readers that I am somehow a bad employee now and was a bad cop because I dont agree with you"
No. It isn't because you don't agree with me. It is because you cannot support your statements.
Lots of people don't agree with me… but their argument makes sense to me from their point of view.
That is respectable… even if I still think they are wrong.
Sometimes they expand my awareness of a situation by allowing me to see a bigger picture. Maybe they even win me over to their way of thinking by showing me a flaw in my reasoning or an aspect I never considered.
It has happened. I will happen.
You, on the other hand, have not really presented an argument to support your statements.
And the statements you have made indicate you were a bad cop and probably a bad employee now. What cop that lazily ignores crime and corruption, while rationalizing it away as no big deal, is good? What employee that doesn't care about wasted tax dollars subsidizing foreign criminals, because his personal taxes won't go up, is a benefit to his workplace or America?
A person without principles is generally untrustworthy and undesirable to have around.
You are what you post… and you have posted nothing but support for organized crime, wasted tax money and the associated corruption that infects senior USFK management… while, without any supporting statements, have rationalized it away as somehow good for America.
What part of this line of thinking warrants any form of respect?
Nobody respects a turd polisher.
6:47 pm on July 23rd, 2009 61
Your first post in this thread wasn't about just DECA it included comments about the AAFES side. You jumped exclusively to the DECA side to try and point out what a hanious crime black marketing is… I sent a link to what AAFES contributes and those aren't BS numbers, AAFES donates 67% of all profits back to the community, that is huge when you consider millions of dollars is poured into the Yongsan economy by BMers. If BMing was hurting the U.S. then the U.S. would put a stop to it…am I wrong in saying that? We can crush other countries in a matter of months, are you blind enough to believe we couldn't stop BMing? The way to stop BMing is to open the market up, let ajuma buy whatever and as much as she want's…it wouldn't be profitable after a while because it would flood the market, we can't do that though because we would be violating the SOFA agreement. Korea is the only place that has this issue of blackmarketing and to say that it would even make a dent in DECA's overall costs if we stopped it is retarded…it wouldn't. When DECA sells it's millions of dollars worth of goods to BMers it gets that 5% surcharge along with it and that equates to a lot of money going back into the system. The more DECA ships, the cheaper the shipping costs are going be…kind of like when you order something from Amazon.com and ship multiple items in one shippment as apposed to multiple items in multiple shipments exept we are talking container ships and not little brown boxes. I would say that some of you need to stop being so dramatic to prove your POV. Through natural progression BMing will die down to the levels of japan as markets in Korea open up and the tax on items go down.
I ran the BMing team for many years, I ruined soldiers careers while dependent wives and KN's got a warning and were back at it again, watched the base commander giving ration cards back to Korean Women in return for favors. Looked at letters from the U.S. Army General's in charge of AAFES and DECA operations explain that they are not in the business of policing, if they pay they stay is their policy. I think that last statement alone shows how much the Army cares about BMing. We are getting stung in the stealing of murchandise by employees, if you want to worry about something worry about theft not items that are being payed full price for.
When I see adjuma BMing I couldn't care less, she isn't hurting me…I mean…SH!T… in the old days at least she took her profits from BMing and poored them into the slots but someone was offended by Ajuma hitting a jackpot here and there and put a stop to that money coming back to base.
8:21 am on July 24th, 2009 62
@#30 BMCOP, I agree with that post. That's the reality.
Bones
12:44 pm on July 24th, 2009 63
"I ran the BMing team for many years, I ruined soldiers careers while dependent wives and KN’s got a warning and were back at it again, watched the base commander giving ration cards back to Korean Women in return for favors."
You [I got filter pwned] scum bag. THIS is exactly what I'm talking about. I do not know how to explain how this statement made my blood boil. How do you sleep at night you PIG. You are the definition of what is wrong with the system. You should have turned your weapon on yourself. Enjoy your golf game, you ass. I hope you at least got an AAM for your diligence, you turd.
4:13 pm on July 24th, 2009 64
Dude, I don't even know how you equate being a soldier and doing my job to the problem at the golf course. What is with some of you posters putting other peope down on a blog? Seems a little pathetic to use a blog to make yourself feel like a tough guy… If you were ever a soldier I am sure you can understand doing what the Military tells you to do.
5:04 pm on July 24th, 2009 65
I was a soldier, no I don't care about being an internet "tough guy" – I made no threats, and yes I was putting you down.
Let me throw that quote out there again, maybe you mis-typed. Read it, really read it and maybe you will understand what tripped my trigger:
“I ran the BMing team for many years, I ruined soldiers careers while dependent wives and KN’s got a warning and were back at it again, watched the base commander giving ration cards back to Korean Women in return for favors.”
Get it? Your "Befehl ist Befehl" defense is weak. Such a defense for immoral acts has a pungent odor that eclipses any value of obedience…
/on a lighter note, you will notice many folks around here equate the USFK golf courses with inefficiency, corruption and general malfeasence. (not to mention – BLACK MARKETING) tada!
6:46 pm on July 24th, 2009 66
Can you stop trying to be clever and just say it like a normal human would? I still don't get what you are refering to…the sentance says basically I was an MP, caught Americans and Koreans BMing and the base commander at the time was having a good time with BMing ajumas and in return gave their confiscated ration cards back… So what in that sentence was being done wrong on my part exactly?
11:03 pm on July 24th, 2009 67
I don't get it either Leon – what's your point with reference to that quote?
6:12 pm on January 9th, 2011 68
Nice blog not to mention precise info. You raise many questions around my mind; you wrote a good post, but it is usually mind provoking, and I need to ponder it some even more.
8:53 pm on December 1st, 2011 69
Our chaplain was “caught” blackmarketing when he bought one 32-oz bottle of mayonnaise over the limit back in 1982 (he loved sandwiches) and was severely punished. Today, with the ration control plates (not paper forms), there should be very little on the retail side. I, too, am amazed that the “system” still allows you to go over your limit. ATMs know how much money I have in the bank; the AAFES/DeCA systems should simply not let anyone buy more than allowed. However, it is still the warehouse, inventory, backrooms where the big thievery is going on. My wife and I have a monthly limit of $950 at the commissary alone – I wish I could afford to spend that much in a month!