By Here is a pretty good article in the New York Times that pretty much sums up the absurdity of the Japanese whaling issue:
It must count as one of the more bizarre bits of diplomacy in recent times. Last week, on the eve of a visit by Japanese Foreign Minister Katsuya Okada, Prime Minister Kevin Rudd of Australia threatened to take Japan to the International Court of Justice if it did not stop whaling in the Southern Ocean, the part of the Indian Ocean south of Australia.One may dismiss this as a politician’s gesture aimed at a domestic audience that has taken to emotional “save the whales” campaigns. Though whale oil and bone had once been Australia’s biggest export, the nation had no tradition of eating whale meat, and a shortage of whales caused the closure of its last whaling station in 1978.
But such outbursts in favor of one member of the mammal kingdom by a major exporter of red meat is likely to do more damage to Australia’s image than to Japan’s. Most of Australia’s Asian neighbors — other than Japan — may not care much one way or the other about whaling. But the tone of moral superiority adopted by Australia — its apparent belief that it is the guardian of the Southern Ocean from Asian depredation — grates on many Asians who also resent environment lessons from a top carbon polluter.
From an Australian perspective it may seem reasonable that the largest, most advanced country in the Southern Ocean should assume some responsibility for it. But such assumptions of its rights and duties in international waters can easily keep alive lingering Asian resentments of Western colonialism — European expansionism that gave a small new nation with a population only a little bigger than Shanghai control over a vast, mineral rich landmass. Does Australia want to control the ocean too, some ask? [New York Times]
Make sure to read the rest but here is how it end:
Australia’s elevation of its selective emotion into a diplomatic feud with its major Asian ally is nothing short of ridiculous.
By the way South Korean whaling gets brought up in the article too, which is something I have long covered here at the ROK Drop. Also you can read my thoughts before in regards to Australian complaints about Japanese whaling here.
1:05 pm on February 25th, 2010 1
Go Australia!
2:24 pm on February 25th, 2010 2
Actually the illgal whaling by Japan is doing her more damage than Australias opposition. All the anti-whaling nations are asking is that Japan honour it's various committments to all the conventions, treaties etc it has signed up to.
Japan's continued and expanded program of scientific whaling is inconsistent with its obligations under the Law of the Sea Convention, the International
Convention for the Regulation of Whaling Convention, the Convention on the Conservation of Antarctic Marine Living Resources (CCAMLR), and the Convention on Biological Diversity to protect and preserve the marine
environment, to protect rare and fragile ecosystems and endangered species, to prepare environmental impact assessments when changes to the marine
environment are likely to be caused by its activities, and to refrain from claiming resources under the guise of marine scientific research. This program is not legitimately "scientific" because it has not been
peer-reviewed and does not have precise quantifiable goals. It is inconsistent with Japan's obligations under the Convention on Biological Diversity because reduces the sustainability of whale species and has
"adverse impacts on biological diversity." It is unquestionably an abuse of right because it invokes Article VIII of the Whaling Convention in a manner
that certainly was unanticipated by the framers of the Convention and has been repeatedly condemned by the majority of the other contracting parties to the Convention.
Three international legal experts panels have declared Japanese whaling illegal.
Maybe you should concentrate on the perpetrator not the opposition.
2:39 pm on February 25th, 2010 3
Actually the an anti-whaling campaign should be like handing out free cash in popularity.
However the anti-whalers are such loathsome attention harlots that many people are now more anti-anti-whalers than pro-Japanese.
2:50 pm on February 25th, 2010 4
Philip writes as if he has a sandwich board inserted up his anal passage, if you think that the slaughter of whales is a sustainable business then you have rocks in your head as well.From Australia we say FOCK OFF yer murdering thieves.
3:41 pm on February 25th, 2010 5
Hamilton talks about harlots
maybe thats something he knows about- especially the Japanese pimps who pay small-poor countries to join the IWC to vote for japan [Like Mongolia -who probably don't even know what a whale looks like]. Instead of calling me names why don't you address the issue of illegal Japanese whaling. But then i don't suppose you actually know much about the issue at all. ahh ignorance is bliss.
6:06 pm on February 25th, 2010 6
Thankgod Ruddy did something finally..
What he has done finally is some of the reason why i voted for him.. Lets hope the Japanese think hes kidding, and Australia does go ahead with it all..
The Japanese whalers are out of date, and if anyone has taken the time to view videos you would agree that it needs to stop now..its disgusting..all in the name of "science" I DON'T THINK SOOOO
They need a new hobby…
I know how about CONSERVATION of our Oceans??? Although it does not involve the slaughter of harmless animals so they would never come at it..how sad for 2010…
btw:
Ahh It must be easy to be an ignorant New York Times article writer..How about ask the Sea Shepherd if you can go on "assignment" with them next slaughter season and see what happens with your own eyes….see the time and effort and passion they put into saving these amazing creatures…
6:19 pm on February 25th, 2010 7
The senseless slaughter of helpless animals must stop.
These poor, defenseless creatures are unable to fight back against the well-equipped murderers who hunt them with the backing of their government and the support of a large percentage of their population.
I urge all of you to spread the word, get involved and stand up to these murderous monsters.
Refrences:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/26/austr…
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/may/08/austr…
http://www.businessgreen.com/business-green/news/…
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/artic…
http://www.animalsaustralia.org/take_action/namib…
7:01 pm on February 25th, 2010 8
You make my point for me DH. You zealots are so overboard you attack anyone who dares question your methods which was my original point. Don't you have to get back to the Sea Shepard so you can dowse someone with acid or blind them with lasers or is it time for a news release troll?
7:50 pm on February 25th, 2010 9
Hamilton -I'd rather be a zealot than a harlot-but that is beside the point. Do you actually have any facts to discuss or are you just an opinionated know-it-none?
9:54 pm on February 25th, 2010 10
ACTUALLY THAT ARTICLE SOUNDS LIKE IT WAS WRITTEN BY A PRO WHALING ORGANISATION..IS THE NEW YORK TIMES ON THE TAKE FROM JAPANESE WHALERS?
10:00 am on February 26th, 2010 11
Hello Hamilton are you sulking cos everyones being nasty to you?
10:05 am on February 26th, 2010 12
[DELETED BY ADMIN]
1:36 pm on February 26th, 2010 13
"Loathesome attention seeking harlot". On the contrary, that can be first observed of you. I am none of those things & for my concern for the whale population and the health of the people who eat them hardly warrants broad sided and grossly inaccurate slander from someone like yourself.
Yes, whaling used to be industry in Australia. WHAT is your point?? You object to reform? Awakening? Realisation? ACTION? PREVENTION? A criminal cannot go straight? An alcoholic cannot give up the bottle? A gambler cannot learn to save? An escort cannot become celibate? Your attempt to again make a point is mute, and in fact you highlight the gross STUPIDITY of CONTINUING a practice that is know to have dire consequences.
Your radical and misguided wailing about "Australian moral superiority", harboring Asian resentments about western colonisation is really heretical. You suggest Australia perhaps instead should dump the expense and responsibilty of sanctuary protection to our Asian neighbours? Laos? Cambodia? Thailand? Timor? Is the sheer irrationality of that starting to dawn on you yet?? Burma? Malaysia? PNG??? You are of curse aware at just how poor these nations are, no?
Are you AWARE antiwhaling sentiment is echoed around the WORLD?? Prowhaling is in fact a minority group because whaling is so widely rejected and deplored as redundant, unnecessary and brutal? What on earth makes you think only Australia and NZ object to whaling, shouldnt you open your eyes some???
You espouse prowhaling babble in support of eating wild, endangered, ocean going whale & counter that with mention of the export of prolific, land-going farmed animals? As sane as comparing pigeons with Kakapo. Of course there's the simple point that a vast land with ability for provide food to the world is being overlooked… lets not let that cloud the rantings tho!
You are a truly myopic harlot in bed with Japan and frankly, not a nice person. Quite boring really!
(BTW, the whalers sprayed themselves with pepper spray, watch the footage)
2:20 pm on February 26th, 2010 14
Hamilton,
I always suspected you were quite boring and I even had my suspicions that you were not a nice person.
But I must say that I am honestly shocked to find you are a truly myopic harlot and you are in bed with Japan.
It even seems you are now the type of guy who will compare pigeons with Kakapo.
It's all very troubling.
I believe in you, though.
I think a combination of counseling and corrective lenses will go a long way toward solving your problems.
Good luck.
1:22 am on February 27th, 2010 15
So whaling is a Japanese tradition that's been going on for hundreds of years. If Japanese whalers have been whaling in the Southern ocean for hundreds of years, how come they didn't discover Australia. Prime Minister Rudd is a clown and an embarassment to Australia.
2:42 pm on February 27th, 2010 16
Sorry Dave Head,
2:50 pm on February 27th, 2010 17
Sorry, Dave, I was enjoying my weekend, I have a life. I'm not sure why my last posting was cut short.
If you want facts, just go google them. The Sea Shepard crew has used lasers to blind the eyes or whalers, thrown acid on them, attempted to foul their propellers with rope and wood, lied about interventions they were no where near, made up gun shot stories, and even most probably from the footage I watched attempted to ram Japanese ships then blame it on the other party. For all these reasons I have little sympathy for the anti-whalers. I like whales, I won't eat whale meat, but I won't pardon the illegal, dangerous and self serving tactics of the Sea Shepard and a number of other groups. They serve themselves not the whales.
So go back to your green mud tower and don't worry about poor ignorant me. You should worry about the damage the SS crew does to your cause which was my first point.
3:27 pm on February 27th, 2010 18
Hamilton-thanks for your reply. I have been researching this subject for over 6 years now. Early on I came to the conclusion [based on reported facts etc] that what the Japanese were doing to whales was wrong.
As i too have a life and am about to go out to a dinner, I will get back to you to bring a few facts to your notice. If you think what the SSCS does is wrong etc then perhaps you should look a little closer for the reasons they take the action they do – and why they have great support from all around the world. In any case more and more people are aware of japanese activities only becasue of Pual Watson and his volunteers.
For the whales
Dave
3:35 pm on February 27th, 2010 19
Speaking of facts & google…
See Japanese whalers spray pepperspary into he wind, therefore onto themselves:
http://www.google.com.au/search?sourceid=navclien…
See small vessel idling in open water, bobbing around like a buoy and sharp turn towards them from large whaler.
http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&rlz=1T4…
watch as many uneditted versions as you can – with open mind, open eyes…
As you claim to refuse pardon of the illegal, dangerous and self serving tactics you'll forthwith be considered ANTI-whaling in that stance, and resultant conclusion that the illgeal use of factory ships used in illegal poaching of an endangered species in an international SANCTUARY. Thank you.
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/rc20080803…
3:51 pm on February 27th, 2010 20
I hope this writer does not make a living from writing balanced opinion articles because it appears that he has failed miserably.
In the concrete jungle where this humaqn lives, his whole live revolves around interacting with other grey suits whos existance and life is controlled by the capitalist system that drip feeds them the reality of their existance.
With all relativity to the real world removed from their controlled existance, I suppose its only to be expected that his blinkered and narrow view of the world is only to be expected in the content of his writing.
As a whale lies dying choking for what seems like an eternity in its own blood, this writer thinks of coffee and whether or not his croissant is buttered the right way up.
That whales baby lies screaming beside her as it dies in agony and fear never knowing the future of growing up to see the beauty of its life unfold before it.
Sir you appear as a lifeless ,soul less ,expression of the failure of humanity in your particular niche in society.
From Australia with love.
3:54 pm on February 27th, 2010 21
The ability to judge ones own relevance in the world is the ability to emphathise with the creatures that reside in it.
4:03 pm on February 27th, 2010 22
The ivory tower of your existance is on the extinction list Hamilton and your mission is one of no revelace to the rest of the world.
One could be sarcastic and say that since you are a Murdoch employee your opinion will never be relative to the facts and in this case its true.
4:40 pm on February 27th, 2010 23
Don't be discouraged, whale-lovers, at least one whale lived up to all its hype.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100226/ap_on_re_us/u…
6:17 pm on February 27th, 2010 24
It's the sake, it has me in its iron grip. Do the SS have a re-education camp?
11:33 pm on February 27th, 2010 25
First of all the whalers would not being spraying pepper spray in the first place that got blown back on them by the wind if Sea Shepherd was conducting their activities against them. Anyway I have never eaten whale and probably never will but with that said I really don't give a crap what people in other countries eat as long as it is done in a sustainable manner.
I have put out these facts over and over again, but let me reiterate them. The Japanese through the International Whaling Commission which Australia is part of, sets yearly quotas for the Japanese to whale in the name of scientific research. There research primarily centered around estimating the numbers of whales in the oceans and proving that sustainable hunting can be done. The Japanese activities have in fact proven that whale populations are expanding to include around the Japanese islands.
The total number of minke whales which the Japanese hunt totals 184,000 left in the ocean. The expanding numbers of this whale population proves that the Japanese are not causing whales to go extinct if they stick to the whaling quota given to them by the IWC.
Even Tim Flannery agrees with the Japanese position on Japanese hunting of whales:
Also the claim of hunting in Australian territorial waters set aside as a whale sanctuary is bogus. In regards to the Japanese whaling in Australian territorial waters this is also a misconception. The misconception is that very few nations recognize the Australian Antarctic Territory. Australia claims 42% of Antarctic territory, yes I said 42% they are claiming! Only Britain, New Zealand, Norway, and France recognize Australia’s claim because they have big claims themselves.
Is it any wonder why the vast majority of the world does not take their claim seriously? It is also why the Australian government will not send the Royal Australian Navy to arrest the whalers because they know that in an international court they will lose.
I have long said that negotiations with the Japanese that would allow them to catch a quota of whales every year commercially at numbers probably lower than what they are whaling now through the IWC could be reached. Recent Japanese statements only verify this viewpoint:
Let’s see Japan wants four communities to legally hunt 150 whales a year which means 600 whales, which is less then what they are hunting now. However, when one side is against whaling period and sends ships to attack the Japanese it has caused the Japanese to make this issue one of nationalism that they will not back down from which is making any agreement impossible. This is an issue in need of statesmanship, but when your statesman is someone like Paul Watson expect only more comedy and idiocy to continue.
9:48 am on February 28th, 2010 26
Trish, stop hyperventilating. This is why less and less people listen to you. As long as you continue to use thug like tactics your cause will be ineffective.
10:02 am on February 28th, 2010 27
This has been the most successful anti whaling season so far..so no one is really concerned with the rantings of a Murdoch paper…
11:25 am on February 28th, 2010 28
No one has answered my question! What about the krill (or even plankton)? Whales, in their blood lust, kill millions, if not billions, of krill DAILY! I know krill are not as "cute" or as easy to relate to but they are an important species nonetheless. We all know whales are "intelligent". Let's talk to the whales and see if we can reason with them. I'm sure they will understand. Lay off the krill or it's going to be a harpoon fest, I say.
FREE THE KRILL!!!!
11:38 am on February 28th, 2010 29
The simple answer is you are a fool, a longer answer would involve exploring your ancestors genetic makeup to determine where your genetic deficiencies originated from.
12:28 pm on February 28th, 2010 30
Whales are predators. They are killers. Death to the whales! …and you're not too bright yourself.
12:43 pm on February 28th, 2010 31
You are American Mr Lacheapport, your opinion doesnt count in waters around Australia and the Southern ocean.
A captive whale in a jail enclosure has all the right in the world to kill his masters of torture.
Japanese whalers are nervous because they know they will possibly pay the ultimate price for their sins.
A HARPOON IS NO FRIEND TO A WHALER IF HE IS FLOATING IN AN OCEAN WATCHING HIS SHIP OF HORRORS SINKING BEFORE HIM.
Why have you not neglected to include the fact that the Japanese and Chinese have just applied to net Krill in huge quantities for feeding their populations?
You accuse whales of being killers but you defend the Japanese who kill both the whales and the Krill?
Why have you failed to address the fact that the Japanese were just caught illegally using a gill net in a protected sanctuary?
You are a fool and that is the simple answer.
6:50 pm on February 28th, 2010 32
http://www.stopwhaling.org/atf/cf/%7BC7E2199F-3FE…
In an effort to resolve the debate, an international panel of independent legal experts came together
in 2006 to examine the issue as it relates to international law.
The panel found that Japanese scientific whaling is in fact “unlawful” under international law, and
contravenes key international conventions – a dramatic finding that opposes Japan’s long-held
stance that it has the legal right to commercially hunt whales in the name of scientific research.
6:53 pm on February 28th, 2010 33
1. “Scientific whaling” does not meet the requirements of the International Convention for the Regulation of Whaling (ICRW) and does not therefore fall within the exemption laid down in its article VIII.
2. There is strong evidence that “scientific whaling” is in violation of the moratorium on commercial
whaling laid down in paragraph 10(e) of the schedule.
3. Such whaling constitutes an abuse of rights afforded by article VIII of the ICRW.
4. “Scientific whaling” raises serious questions of compliance with articles 64, 65, 87, 116, 117,
119, 120, 240, 241 and 251 of the U. N. Convention on the Law of the Sea and/or may constitute an abuse of rights contrary to article 300 of that Convention.
5. “Scientific whaling” raises serious questions of compliance with the Convention on Biological
Diversity, the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of wild flora and fauna,and the Convention on the Conservation of Antarctic Marine Living Resources.
6. “Scientific whaling” as conducted in particular by the government of Japan, is not consistent with the requirements of paragraph 30 of the schedule to the ICRW, nor with requirements of article
VIII of the convention.
and of course there is more. But i really doubt you want to debate these issues.
7:01 pm on February 28th, 2010 34
As noted by a number of scientists participating in the work of the IWC Scientific Committee and others, the government of Japan is conducting “scientific whaling” on an increasingly commercial scale and for apparently economic and commercial purposes.
Such whaling contravenes the prohibition on commercial whaling agreed by the parties at paragraph 10(e) of the schedule to the convention;
• The government of Japan has not demonstrated to the satisfaction of the IWC Scientific Committee that its special permit whaling:
• Has been authorized in special circumstances;
• Meets critically important research needs;
• Fulfils criteria set out in the guidelines for review of special permits established by that committee in relation to objectives, methodology and the effects of catches on stocks;
• Takes adequate account of the development of alternative non-lethal research techniques;
• Does not jeopardize the conservation of whales in sanctuaries, including those classified internationally as endangered and vulnerable.
8. The government of Japan has failed to cooperate with the IWC by consistently refusing to withdraw or restructure its “scientific whaling” programs as requested by the Commission on numerous occasions, most recently by resolution 2005-1.
9. A resolution adopted by the majority of the IWC that purported to determine that such “scientific
whaling” is lawful, would not be capable of altering the legal obligations arising under the ICRW
in relation to the prohibition on commercial whaling and the conditions under which scientific whaling may be conducted, nor would such a resolution be capable of altering the scope of legal obligations arising under other relevant international acts or instruments, and would therefore be without legal effect in altering the rights and obligations of the parties to the ICRW
7:28 pm on February 28th, 2010 35
I assume you are Australian, Mr "Whale Freedom, (and also a douche bag) your opinion doesn't count for much outside the waters around Australia and the Southern ocean.
If you are attempting to win friends to your cause, insulting people is likely not going to bring you converts. But perhaps your are not interested in winning anyone over. Perhaps you are more interested in being a blustering jack-ass. Well played sir, you have succeeded.
7:36 pm on February 28th, 2010 36
Its better that you follow me around commenting than actually writing any more misguided dribble…
I am glad to have been the cause of you wasting time here, that neans for a little longer someone was safe somewhere for a little while for you are a PSCYCOPATHIC KILLER.
8:34 pm on February 28th, 2010 37
For a second, I thought the article actually meant something. Then I read the lead in and found out that it's just Bowling's opinion. Couldn't Bowling interject his opinion into an "opinion column"? I believe he could.
Here again is nothing but opinion, supposition, and inflamatory conjecture.
This is simply a perspective of moral values and nothing more. Either your morals allow for the Japanese harvesting whales to eat under the guise of scientific research or they don't. There is nothing more to it.
For others I can urinate in your face and tell you it's raining.
9:05 pm on February 28th, 2010 38
The use of factory ships IS illegal in "scientific" whaling. IS ILLEGAL.
First of all the whalers would not being spraying pepper spray in the (SECOND) place that got blown back on them by the wind if Sea Shepherd was conducting their activities against them. (You conceed they sprayed themselves with pepper spray. SS would not have been there in the first place is illegal commerical whaling (or scientific whaling with ILLEGAL factory ships). If you think it's cool for illegal factory ships to be in a sanctuary, WHAT is your problem with any one ELSE being there? Hmmmmmmm????)
Anyway I have never eaten whale (Good) and probably never will (Good) but with that said I really don’t give a crap what people in other countries eat (yet you're the one who posted comment like errr "an attention seeking harlot" as long as it is done in a sustainable manner (It's NOT, dont you get it?)
Anyway, aparently I'm short of breath from being a thug… shit, broke a nail.
8:58 am on March 1st, 2010 39
Yep, you're a thug.
9:18 am on March 1st, 2010 40
Wow. Just Wow. You Eco-loons might be worse than hardcore christians/muslims. You are some radical and dangerous minded folks, that's for sure.
I not sure I wasn't before, but you have made up my mind for me. I am most definitely anti-antiwhaler.
You call me a psychopathic killer? Here's a quote from you: "A HARPOON IS NO FRIEND TO A WHALER IF HE IS FLOATING IN AN OCEAN WATCHING HIS SHIP OF HORRORS SINKING BEFORE HIM."
That statement is tantamount to calling for murder. Are you one of those moon-bats who actually think some animals life is more precious than a HUMAN life?
-and maybe it's you that is being distracted. Though I don't really care. You self-righteous and impotent rage accomplish nothing but illustrate you and the fellow followers of your case as a bunch of internet wanna-be tough guy teenagers full of angst and seeking a cause. I guess as long as it keeps you off the streets and out of trouble, it's mostly harmless. It certainly is a good laugh for the rest of us.
If I didn't think you really were serious, I'd think you was pulling my leg.
SAVE THE KRILL!!!!
11:21 am on March 1st, 2010 41
Leon,
I'm with you. DH actually makes the attempt at education on why he thinks Whaling is wrong and I can respect that. However the vast crowd, MB, WTF, Trish, Austin etc are what drives people away from anti-whaling causes. You get the feeling they would strangle you in your sleep to save a whale and not feel bad at all, the ends justify any means. Very scary people.
1:19 pm on March 1st, 2010 42
Hamilton – one always knows that you have won a debate when the only response you get is "yep you are a thug".
Its probably because there is not a lot you can say to defend dishonourable people that break their agreements.
In fact if you consider everything that has gone on it is clear that those involved in the Japanese whaling industry are a pack of thugs
There actually a number of sites where one can debate the issues. So unless you can put up -I suggest you shut up as you have nothing worthwhile to respond to.
For the Whales-Dave
1:49 pm on March 1st, 2010 43
Hamilton – one always knows that you have won a debate when the only response you get is “yep you are a thug”.
—
I didn't realize that you are Trish as well, it does explain at least her strange behavior.
It is interesting that you continue the strawman that I am defending the Japanese. Condeming the anti-whale crowd's behavior is not the same thing. I tried to point out that the violent and often illegal protest activities are losing you a lot of support but you seem to think that is okay. As for debate of the issue here at the ROK Drop, you seem to forget what forum you and your sockpuppet army dropped in on.
For the Humans-Hamilton
2:02 pm on March 1st, 2010 44
I see the Japanese went home broke this year, this means the anti whaling movement has the right strategies in place to end the slaughter.
Despite this crap written by a basement dwelling mushroom, the fight goes on …
Ya know what they say about mushrooms dont you ?
They live in the dark and thrive in shit and if you let the rays of sunlight in (aka the truth) they shrivel up and die.
8:51 pm on March 1st, 2010 45
Nah, sweetie… you're just having a little hissy fit coz you dont intimidate me. That doesnt make me a thug. PMSL, scary indeed… strangle you in you sleep? You wish honey. You know for a bloke who 'doesn't support whaling' you're pretty hell bent on bad mouthing people who are simply aiming to prevent yet another extinction courtesy modern man! LOL, BOO!
9:00 pm on March 1st, 2010 46
Strange behaviour!??? Classic. Hamilton, are you doing OK?
10:54 pm on March 1st, 2010 47
And what species is going extinct again?
10:53 am on March 3rd, 2010 48
Hamilton,
I don't know what it means yet but this morning one of my computers suggested the best way to solve the radical whale problem here is to call in an airstrike at -39.484434,176.906607.
Does that location mean anything to you?
1:19 pm on March 3rd, 2010 49
hey chickenshit how long did you spend on that little project. Maybe you would be better informing yourself of the issues. In any case to solve the whaling problem you would have to do an air strike about where two atomic bombs were dropped in 1945.
3:47 pm on March 3rd, 2010 50
You know you've won a debate when you get called a chickensh*t.
4:22 pm on March 3rd, 2010 51
"chickenshit"?
Awww, Dave, buddy, that was uncalled for.
Don't hate the playa'.
But, in answer to your query, I didn't spend any time on that project.
That's what computers are for…
…lots of big, powerful computers sneakily gossiping amongst themselves and dripping with bleeding-edge software that is presumably designed to find terrorists and pedophiles using incomprehensible fuzzy logic algorithms that were supposedly formulated in pure binary by other computers.
…and it gets smarter all the time… though not always in a good way.
Of course they can, are and will be used for less noble purposes.
Gone are the days of trips to the library… and, going soon, are the days of Googling 23 million semi-relevant hits hoping to luck out.
On the down-side, AI is in its infancy… so getting information from the damn thing(s) is somewhere between questioning a 4 year-old and talking to the dog.
And it kinda has a mean streak.
Due to your response, I pestered it for the last 10 minutes until it told me why those numbers are important (to you). Pretty funny, actually.
It kinda misled me that Hamilton would see the humor… I guess it is the case but more on a second level of thinking as the joke is all of us… and, I suspect there is a third level we have not yet discovered.
If it makes you feel better, I ain't ever hookin' it up to Skynet… for obvious reasons.
Also, I don't support hunting whales… if that makes you feel better, too.
Oh… and there is a classified but low-level NZSIS surveillance order on that location. It might not be paranoia if you feel your lamp is watching you.
4:44 pm on March 3rd, 2010 52
Much better there than a strike on my namesake across the island. I'm actually pro-whale, anti-anti whalers.
For the Humans
8:35 pm on March 3rd, 2010 53
Maybe you should stop being an antiwhaling antogonist then & concentrate on being an anti pro whaler.
11:11 pm on March 3rd, 2010 54
Because if you and your ilk are representative of anit-pro-whalers, we want nothing to do with you. As long as you associate, and cannot understand the problem that normal people have, with the Sea Shepard bunch, you'll never get it. Super zealots turn the majority off your cause – ANY cause. Make arguments that make sense and let the intelligent people decide.
1:36 pm on March 5th, 2010 55
LOL, you should read through your posts, you're contrary & disqualified as sensible. I hardly think being an antagonist for no other reason is 'normal', nor is assuming anyone who strongly opposses whaling is of any particular 'ilk'. You assume FAR too much about the demographics of a HUGE population of the world who object to whaling, & as for your opposition to atiwhaling its worth noting the distance from you to me is equal and identical to the distance from me to you. Some would counter that you yourself are a super zealot. What a shame your 'intelligence' prevents you from doing something other than being a mere obstructive antagonist. Thank GOD you're not deciding for me!!
You know, insulting in the same breath as objecting to insult is ineffective.
2:14 pm on March 5th, 2010 56
You assume far too much about the demographics of a huge population of the world that doesn't give a flip about whaling, they are more interested in eating and providing a better living for their children. Hence your problem, you know best and you are willing to ram it down the throats of the unenlighted, the dull, the weak or anyone who either happens to disagree with your METHODs let alone your pet project. Keep throwing Acid on people and blinding them with lasers Trish, keep it classy.
2:51 pm on March 5th, 2010 57
LOL like I say, you assume far too much. Having responded to your post makes me a thug, a zealot, a throat rammer, a RANCID BUTTER (poor bubbies) thrower and classless?
WHO says I agree with SS methods? WHO says I have disregard for a person's drive to care for their family? WHO says I dont hve the same struggle? The world is FULL of people who strive to care for their families, not just Japanese whalers! You have NO idea how much thought I've given this issue, or the related topics, but with other food, other jobs, other solutions, what's your point?
http://trendsupdates.com/japanese-whaling-is-bad-…
In the absence of a viable, agreeable solutions, I chose to not condone whaling against a long standing whaling ban of endangered mammals. Simple. Bottom line: for or against. I'm against. That hardly makes me a classless thug as concluded by you two.
2:08 am on March 6th, 2010 58
You are continuing to perpetuate a myth, the Minke Whales the Japanese are hunting are not endangered.
10:23 am on March 6th, 2010 59
Trish,
Every statement you have made condones the violence of the SS and attacks the whalers. You even went so far as to cherry pick some youtube moments in their defense. So yes, you do support them and violence against people you disagree with.
Your tactics are those of a bully and a thug, I and many like me are far to strong to be intidated by weak people like you. You have convinced me to try whale meat. It is available here in Korea. Cheers, now go hyperventilate and dig deeper into daddy's trust fund.
4:19 pm on March 6th, 2010 60
Humpback whales and Fin whales the Japanese are ALSO hunting ARE endangered.
Do not put words in my mouth. I do not condone but that doesnt mean Japan didnt ram Ady Gil. Do not put characteristics on me. I am no thug – certainly no more than either of you two!. But you think being steadfast is thuggery and apathy is strong, what a joke. I have no issue preferring the lesser of the two evils. I have no issue preferring one or the other over sheer reticent apathy. I'd like to have a say in the outcome thanks all the same!
Oh crap, I have a trust fund from Daddy?? Wish you'd told me sooner all seeing, all knowing…. AHhahahahahah, you guys are well out of the drop zone!
LOL, you've had the last laugh hey, eating whale. Well done champ, you win… good luck with name calling & apathy, you'll need it when the mercury kicks in!!
Adios jerks!
6:20 pm on March 6th, 2010 61
Another post and another set of lies, half truths and misdirection from Trish.
Lie number 1, Japan agreed to not hunt humpbacks for two years starting in 2008 meaning they are not hunting humpbacks.
Lie number 2, As a species, Humpbacks are not endangered. In August 2008, the IUCN changed humpback's status from Vulnerable to Least Concern, although two subpopulations remain endangered. Overall populations have rebounded to over 80,000.
Lie number 3, "the Andy Gil was deliberatly rammmed…" The Andy Gil was one of the fastest water craft in the world, it would have no problem getting out of a whaling ships way if it wanted to, but that wasn't the point was it? It needed to be hit for the publicity.
Hypocrisy number 1, "I have no issue preferring the lesser of two evils." Which followed "I do not condone, but that doesn't mean…"
Hypocrisy number 2, Telling someone "adios Jerks" and complaining about name calling.
Again, you would be better advised to try and educate instead of quibble away inconvienient details. "The Fin whale is endangered and the Japanese do hunt them!" Actually they didn't kill any in the last hunting season and they may not this year, the only true statement is that the Fin is endangered unlike the Humpback.
You eco-thugs spend too much time on intimidation, misdirection, and outright lying. No one can trust anything you say even if you have good points. I'll try not to eat a fin, but Humpback looks good for dinner.
1:18 am on March 7th, 2010 62
Yeah they hunted 14 fin whales since 1986, big deal:
http://www.iwcoffice.org/conservation/table_permi…
Greenland has an IWC permit for 19 fin whales every year. Go protest them. Go protest the shipping industry as well as far more fin whales die from ship collisions than from whaling. Fin whales are actually the number one whale hit by ships:
http://www.nero.noaa.gov/shipstrike/whatsnew/Lais…
Let me also enlighten you that contrary to popular belief humpback whales are not endangered:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humpback_whale
Also the Japanese do not hunt humpback whales. They asked the IWC for a permit to hunt 50 humpback whales and the IWC put the permit on hold because of protests:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7156288.s…
The humpback whale is not endangered and I could care less if Japan hunts 50 of them. Any more myths you want me to debunk for you? Remember you are playing in the big leagues over here because ROK Drop commenters don't take whale propaganda at face value.
11:02 am on August 20th, 2010 63
It's official.
New Zealand has now killed more whales than the Japanese.
Ready the acid, lasers and protest ships!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100820/ap_on_sc/as_n…
12:33 pm on August 20th, 2010 64
I hope that the Japanese will stop whaling but I think knowing human nature that with all this pressure & with the SS people that the Japanese are just going to say 'F you' & do what they want. The envirowackos want zero whale harvested, they even oppose the Inuits(Eskimos) taking the few whales that they are allowed to. I don't know what a sustainable numbers of whales harvested would be but I would hope the Japanese would realize that it is in their best interest not to causes the whales to become extinct. Many westerners in the past have had a paternalistic idea that what we do is ok but that what other cultures do is not. For example in Korea they eat dog meat which to many westerners is gross but when you think about it what is the difference between eating a dog or eating a cow or chicken, it's all meat. Also why is it ok to kill & eat a less intelligent animal like a cow or chicken but wrong to eat an intelligent animal like a whale? Are we discriminating against stupid animals?
2:11 pm on August 20th, 2010 65
mmmmm sweet meat
6:05 pm on August 21st, 2010 66
chicenhead [it shows] "New Zealand has now killed more whales than the Japanese." Since the Japanese kill 20,000+ cetaceans a year I think we can safely say you talk crap.
8:42 pm on August 22nd, 2010 67
Dave,
C'mon. I'm not your enemy here. I'm not pushing an agenda of whalers' rights or advocating the wonders of whale BBQ.
And, obviously, my post was a joke. Beached whales don't compare to hunted whales. Knock off the false (or unbelievably dumb) outrage.
However, more seriously, I feel Paul Watson's career has shown more concern for his self-promotion than for saving whales.
Like so many professional activists, his biggest fear is that the problem will be solved and he will have to go back to asking if the customer would like fries with that.
And, like most radical militant actions, minority-backed violent protests and acts of terrorism, these methods only serve to harden the resolve of the targeted governments and people…
…and, in this case, result in the continuation of more senseless whale slaughter.
Thanks for nothing, Paul Watson.
So, the more someone mindlessly supports such a cause the more they they are pleading to be a target of ridicule.
So, what do I mean by "mindlessly"? How about this…
"Since the Japanese kill 20,000+ cetaceans a year I think we can safely say you talk crap."
Uh-huh… but we aren't talking about cetaceans. We are talking about whales.
So, while you are mindlessly horrified at that manufactured number, reality is that Japan's target is only 1000 and they seem to have been getting between 300 and 800 with an average of around 444/year for the last 25 years since limits on whaling went into effect.
This is a long way from 20,000.
So, what about the 19,556 bottlenose dolphins the Japanese catch each year. Well, they aren't endangered… so what's the problem? They are just another animal to harvest… pigs of the sea, if you will.
Ahhh… I know… the misery and death of beautiful, and possibly even sentient, creatures?
Well, not too far north, there is misery and death of 20,000,000 creatures confirmed to be sentient… also known as North Koreans.
So, while saving endangered whales might be a worthy goal, placing plentiful dolphins ahead of people is only going to pull the heartstrings of a minority (many of which don't care about people either)… and it detracts from the more important message of saving substantially more rare whales which many see as a good cause.
Now, back to New Zealand.
Interestingly, New Zealand is a (the?) global center for cetacean strandings… with 13,000 strandings since cursory records started being kept in 1840.
In only 207 recorded strandings of pilot whales, 7000 whales have died…
…too many pilot whales and not enough navigator whales, I guess.
Now that's only 207 incidents out of 13,000. How many senseless deaths happened in the other 12,793?
Face it. New Zealand kills a LOT of cetacean… and it just keeps killing… and most happen in the same area over and over again.
If Paul Watson (and you) really wanted to save cetacean, time and money could be better spent patrolling these stranding hotspots and banging pots and pans or something… maybe shooing whales back into deeper waters.
At the least, instead of chasing after Japanese boats to (maybe) save a few whales, more time should be spent encouraging the government of New Zealand to research and deploy methods and equipment to reduce this needless slaughter.
What WON'T save whales is giving holier-than-thou lectures on the wonders of an irritating self-promoter who many reasonable and logical people, with no emotional attachment one way or another, see as doing more to harm whales than help them.
12:05 pm on August 28th, 2010 68
When confronted with reasonable conclusions based on facts rather than emotions, whale warriors get awfully quiet.
10:33 pm on August 28th, 2010 69
Hey chicken shit we are still here, Ive just been busy tracking down yer workplace address so I can meet up and show you how having yer head inserted up yer arse is a form of origami, not sushi.
12:07 am on August 29th, 2010 70
Ahhh, Mark…
C'mon, man.
Name calling and threats of violence don't endear anyone to the Cause…
…and they certainly don't address any of the valid points I made in the above post.
Reasonable demands based on reality rather than emotional idealism and backed up with intelligent debate will save more whales than lies and threats.
Factual misrepresentations, angry emotional outbursts and advocacy of violence, alienate the majority of average people who are frequently too apathetic and preoccupied to actively care about their own futures… let alone whales.
When you make a hateful, yet content-starved, post under the guise of saving whales, you do a disservice to your cause… and, in the long run, needlessly cause the death of more whales to satisfy your own ego.
"Ive just been busy tracking down yer workplace address"
Well… I guess yer gonna have to work harder.
Perhaps we can meet somewhere for a little head-ass origami. Sounds kinky. Just remember, I call "back of the line" for any daisy chains you want to organize.
I'll be in Hawthorn, Mitcham, Adelaide, Australia next week. Wouldn't it be a strange coincidence if that just happened to be where you were going to be?
12:19 am on September 2nd, 2010 71
Finally…
…proof that Australia, through conservation efforts, has blown whales all out of proportion.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/wildlife/7977013…
BTW…
Why is it that radical whale lovers always call names and make threats… but don't like to discuss facts or unemotionally debate opinion… even reasonable ones that could actually lead to saving more whales.
I don't get it.
I'm starting to think whale conservation is a catch-all of last resort for people a few dolphins short of a pod, if ya know what I mean.
3:15 am on September 2nd, 2010 72
I dispute #71 is Chickenhead.
Whomever you are – (Mr. Japanese man) anything which references the International Whaling Commission has to be true! right?
11:48 am on September 2nd, 2010 73
Lemmy,
It's me. Maybe you didn't get it.
I said: "Australia, through conservation efforts, has blown whales all out of proportion."
The article is about the Australian government… wait for it… blowing up a whale! And, after that, it probably didn't fit its original proportions.
8:27 am on September 22nd, 2010 74
New Zealand's senseless slaughter of whales continues!
http://web.orange.co.uk/article/news/mass_pilot_w…
Another 40 whales needlessly killed.
Now, when I posted about the 58 whales that died just up the beach from these last month, I was kinda joking about New Zealand needlessly killing whales.
Now I realize that I should have been serious.
These whales WERE needlessly killed.
Through inaction, New Zealand and many holier-than-thou anti-whaling activists are murdering whales… and it has been going on for a long time in numbers I never imagined.
While Paul Watson is off shining lights and throwing butter at Japanese ships to save a whale or two, the much more mundane task of patrolling the areas where hundreds of whales continue to die every year is left undone.
So, is it really all about saving whales? Or is it about everything else… from publicity to generating funds to play pirate?
Kinda disgusting when one thinks about it.
Like most professional activists, perpetuating the problem becomes more important than the stated goals.
While I have yet to get an intelligent response from any of the whale-lovers here, I would hope someone could address this.
It seems substantially less expensive yet more productive to patrol the places where whales have been continually killing themselves year after year and chase them away when they get too close.
Any thoughts on this that don't involve coming to my workplace and putting my head up my arse?
Anybody?
11:37 am on September 22nd, 2010 75
Chicken fooker is full of shit.
Theres two types of anti activists, the whale killers and the whale killers.
2:51 pm on September 22nd, 2010 76
Whale Freedom,
Thanks for your comment… of sorts.
Keep in mind, many people see a post starting with ChickenFunker or ChickenShyt and believe that I have already "won" the argument.
But I'm not trying to "win"… as there is no winning or losing here. There is only working out a solution that is in the best interests of the whales.
Despite poking fun at what appears to be a highly sensitive group with the indignant anger of the spaz kid, and communication skills to match, our values concerning whales may not be so different.
You stated, "Theres two types of anti activists, the whale killers and the whale killers."
I'm guessing your point is that if you are "anti-activist", you are a whale killer.
I don't think I can agree.
While I am anti-professional activist (for just about everything), I have never killed a whale. In fact, I made a very good suggestion to save a large number of whales at a fraction of the cost "professional activists" require to save a whale or two.
I'm not a zealot, but if I lived in an area where whales beached themselves every year, I would certainly volunteer a couple times a month to grab a case of beer and a couple of buddies and patrol up and down the shoreline looking for whales that got too close and were heading in the wrong direction… then we could play Justin Bieber music, throw depth charges or speak in Japanese… whatever fearful thing the experts say will drive the whales away.
Considering the number of volunteers who show up to attempt the statistically futile task of putting the whales back in the water, I'm guessing there are a lot of people who would be interested in prevention… especially if it was marketed as a fun day on the seas with good people of like mind.
Further, for a fraction of the money spent by professional activists who achieve dubious results, a small ship manned by a couple of full-time employees and augmented with volunteers could provide a good deal of coverage.
And, for much less than the cost of the Andy Gil, a sensor network could be installed, maintained and monitored to increase efficiency of workers and volunteers.
Sure, "Whale Wars" is more sensational and entertaining than "Whale Waiting"… but probably less productive in number of whales saved, cost per saved whale and attraction of average people who are potential financial doners and prefer practical solutions by professional people over manufactured outrage and exaggerated hype carried out by self-promoting showmen.
Now you may comment on why this sincerely-made suggestion will never work…
…or you can just call me names and further tarnish the poor opinion of radical whale activists held by the vast majority of the (donating) population who see crazy talk and crazy actions more than they see hard work and true concern.
4:27 pm on September 22nd, 2010 77
George Bush doesn't care about the whales.
7:07 pm on September 22nd, 2010 78
Chikenhead, your suggestions for 'saving' whales in New Zealand maybe genuine, but I doubt it, it's more likely to be in the area of satire. If you care to check you will find we have a coastline longer than the US with only a tiny fraction of the population. Much of the coastline is remote and with small populations. We do indeed have a number of whale groups organised to helped beached whales. To somehow try to negate our objections to Japanese whaling because whales, for whatever reason/s, strand on our beaches is rather an obtuse arguement. If you look at a map and see that we are a long narrow country- stuck out on our own in the middle of a huge ocean, then you might understand that whales could easily beach themselves. The suggestion that NZ kills whales is just a provocative nonsense, which I am sure you already realise.
7:08 pm on September 22nd, 2010 79
Leon, George who?
7:24 pm on September 22nd, 2010 80
New Zealand has a coast line longer than the US? I somehow thought that Alaska with its multitude of islands and Hawaii would make our coastline much longer than the relatively smaller New Zealand islands.
8:15 pm on September 22nd, 2010 81
Perhaps the whales which beach themselves, for whatever reason, are suicidal. Perhaps the ones that swim near the whaling fleets are as well. They're very smart after all.
11:18 pm on September 22nd, 2010 82
Dave,
Your sweeping geography lesson of New Zealand's vast coastline certainly paints a hopeless picture of preventing strandings through preventative patrols.
…but, as a Kiwi and a whale activist, you seem somewhat uninformed of the finer points of New Zealand geography… or you are being intentionally misleading.
New Zealand is world-famous for "whale traps"… places like Farewell Spit where year-after-year, many cetaceans are stranded.
The millions of dollars it takes to chase Japanese ships in remote waters to save a few whales could be better spent on the local economy with real results.
It starts looking more and more as if professional whale activists are more interested in a lot of things other than saving whales.
The locals certainly love whale strandings as it brings in a lot of business for a few days.
Dave, for the last 9 years I have been building underwater equipment from video/light housings to various sensors and special-purpose devices… mostly for profit… but occasionally as a donation to support a project I believe in… some of which may be known to readers here.
I put a few minutes of thought into how to detect and herd whales away from stranding hotspots… partially inspired by the methods the Japanese fishermen used to herd dolphins in The Cove.
My way requires much less man-power (a boat and Jet Ski or two) and uses cheap, simple, reliable and easily-deployable equipment which can cover several kilometers. Automated systems could be even be possible with real funding.
While I imagine I could throw a prototype together and give a demonstration in Taijii resulting in a profitable sale, I'd rather not.
If anyone showed any interest in using such a device to save cetaceans, I'd be happy to share my initial ideas and related technical knowledge in hopes of developing a working device in conjunction with others who have knowledge and experience working with cetaceans.
At the least, it could be used to herd away the other whales that frequently lurk around beached whales… and wind up getting beached themselves.
But, I expect no takers. There is much more reward in shining lights and throwing butter for the TV cameras.
Which reminds me… in The Cove, the answer on how to get the Japanese to stop killing dolphins and whales is right there… spoken in plain English… yet nobody caught it.
Due to pride and profit, guys like Paul Watson are doing the EXACT thing that perpetuates the continued slaughter of cetaceans.
If anyone is curious what part of The Cove clearly explains how to make the Japanese stop, I'll be happy to explain it. While it is very obvious to a casual observer, those blinded by radical ideology, fanatical idealism, an activist agenda and a narrow Western point-of-view probably missed it…
…even the filmmaker might have missed the true point… including the statements only to demonize the Japanese without realizing the true implications of what was said.
More on that if anyone is interested. Apart from a bit of nonsensical speculation that dolphins might be smarter than humans, The Cove is interesting and generally worth watching and I recommend it.
12:31 am on September 23rd, 2010 83
Hey chickenfood, not once do I believe you, we could all go to sony and buy cheap speakers but thats not the point, the point is you put this post up here to antagonise those of us that work in the field.I dont give a fock what Watson does, if he saves a whale, good on him.I wouldnt see you down in Antarctica putting out your sound bouys attached to japanese whaling boats.We are Australians and Kiwis and if we want to shoot you fookers that tresspass in our waters we bloody well will.
12:32 am on September 23rd, 2010 84
HAMILTON IS JUST A PIECE OF SHIT.
11:19 am on November 30th, 2010 85
It looks like Sea Shepherd has a new way to put yet another dent in Japanese whaling.
http://www.seashepherd.org/news-and-media/news-10…
BTW… What ever happened to Mark Bailey? He threatened to put my head up my butt… but when I mentioned I would be in his neighborhood, he got quiet. Maybe he got the message I left for him.
8:15 pm on June 15th, 2011 86
It turns out that Japan’s whaling IS for research…
…as there is no real way to eat radioactive whales.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9NRIS780&show_article=1