By Michelle Rhee went through a lot to make this happen, but finally at least some teachers in America are being held accountable for their performance:
The District of Columbia public school system announced Friday that it is letting 226 employees go for poor performance under the education assessment system IMPACT.
Another 76 employees will be terminated because of licensing issues, schools Chancellor Michelle Rhee said in a news release. Of the 302 employees who are losing their jobs, 241 are teachers, she said.
“Every child in a District of Columbia public school has a right to a highly effective teacher — in every classroom of every school, of every neighborhood or every ward, in this city,” Rhee said.
Rhee did not break down the number of teachers fired for poor performance versus licensing issues.
Under the IMPACT program, teachers were judged on five classroom observation visits by principals and outside education experts. The system also rates teachers based on their students’ achievement.
In response to the firings, the Washington Teachers Union released the results of a membership study showing that “a large majority of teachers believe that IMPACT is not a fair evaluation system.”
Washington Teachers Union President George Parker said, “It is evident from this survey that our members agree that IMPACT is a flawed instrument with many loopholes.” [CNN]
It is only flawed to them because they are being held accountable for their performance. Hopefully the teachers that are performing well will get the steep pay raise that Rhee was pushing.
You can read my prior profile on Michelle Rhee here.
She hasn’t seen...
8:31 pm on July 24th, 2010 1
If only there was a way to hold the parents accountable. Better teachers isn't the whole solution to underperforming school kids.
9:16 pm on July 24th, 2010 2
#1,
Exactly. Teachers are going to be held accountable for problems caused by poor parenting, or lack thereof.
11:15 pm on July 24th, 2010 3
What you mean parents who sell drug their children will preform no different then say the child with two caring parents who went to college and live in a nice neighborhood? Teachers can only do so much at some point a ghetto kid and a suburban kid can not be judge on the same level… I went to catholic school and will send my kids to catholic school . I went to public college and kids got away with things I stopped doing in 3rd grade. What about special Education will they all be fire because the kids are not only Leaning Disabled Emotionally Disturbed. I say Voucher are the only way!
12:39 am on July 25th, 2010 4
In reference to the first few comments, parents are an issue, yes, but if they are not available as a functional resource, then the school system is tasked with getting the job some other way. Do we condemn kids just because their parents are mucked up or don't see the value of education?
GI Korea wrote:
It is only flawed to them because they are being held accountable for their performance.
I don't think it's that simple. I would agree that teachers unions are entrenched against this issue, but it's an overly simplistic view that they are entrenched primarily because they want to protect subpar teachers.
The pay-for-performance idea is itself a facile fix, because it assumes a couple things that should not be.
First, it assumes that such an inherently qualitative aspect of teacher quality is readily quantifiable. How do you determine this? By teaching tests? I don't mind higher test standards for people getting in the gate (akin to reaching a certain level on the SAT), but regularly testing them to determine their performance-based pay (akin to paying them higher or lower for a high or low SAT score they obtain each year) does nothing to actually improve performance.
What other quantitative measures do you use? An increase in test scores? Then you have teachers teaching to tests instead of more important issues, and suddenly we've got the worst aspects of the Korean educational system going.
Secondly, it assumes that teachers primarily oriented toward pay will not gravitate toward the positions where the pay calculations will come easier. There will be fewer quality teachers willing to take the risk of jobs in poorer neighborhoods or rural schools.
You will also lose potential good teachers who don't want to subject themselves to the inherent insecurity of (possibly) wildly varying pay from year to year that may come about through no fault of their own.
Pay-for-performance is a feel-good proposition that only shifts around the problem. We need (a) parents who care; (b) teachers who can effectively do the job regardless of whether the parents care; (c) an sufficiently funded school system that provides a quality environment for the kids and quality pay for teachers so that we can attract those aforementioned teachers; and (d) a system that allows us effectively and fairly determine which teachers are doing well, which need training and help that the school system will provide them, and which need to leave the profession.
The educational unions may be too entrenched to work on (d), but that is because they are being bombarded with "ideas" that are often even worse than their own entrenchment.
3:17 am on July 25th, 2010 5
"Do we condemn kids just because their parents are mucked up or don’t see the value of education?"
Do we condemn teachers because some kids don't and–more importantly–won't see the value of education?
3:29 am on July 25th, 2010 6
Teadrinker wrote:
Do we condemn teachers because some kids don’t and–more importantly–won’t see the value of education?
Teadrinker, please re-read what I wrote in #4 if you don't see that I'm expressly not condemning the teachers for that.
I do believe that quality teachers (and even some not-so-quality teachers) can inspire kids who are mucked up and/or don't see the value of education to do better and even thrive. But at the same time I also see the various pay-for-performance schemes as inadvertently pushing good teachers away from the schools or classrooms where such kids are more likely to be, because of the risk that even their quality performance will not be enough for them to hit all the right notes for them to qualify for the pay-for-performance incentives.
5:03 am on July 25th, 2010 7
More important issues? That's pretty vague. In the D.C. public school system, I daresay "more important issues" for this demographic of teachers ranges from 'how to make you jerri™-curls stick after an all-night bender," to "how to improve your chances of getting 'Section 8'," to "how to avoid getting busted for dealing or using crack/meth amphetamines/your candy of choice." Only in a WASPish college-prep environment predominately in the East-coast, old money, blue-blood tradition can we assume that professors are elucidating their young charges in dulcet tones about the classics, social responsibility and the heady issues of the times. But that's what makes the Eight Schools Association & Ten Schools Admission Organization (ESA & TSAO)who and what they are, which is in direct contrast to the shell-of-a-school — if you can even call it that — that Michelle Rhee is trying to hold together.
And that's a cheap shot and a false analogy to compare the D.C. educational system under Chancellor Rhee with the Korean educational system. First of all, Michelle Rhee is not a product of the Korean education system. She is a product of Ohio public schools, private college prep schools and the Ivy League.Second, don't underestimate the Korean educational system. While the Korean educational system cannot be compared to the West regarding its instruction in the language arts, social sciences and history (since every country has its own cultural interpretation of how these topics should be taught and approached), the only quantitative barometer on school performance is in the math and sciences, which Korea — along with Taiwan, Japan, Singapore and China — do extremely well in leaving their U.S. counterparts in the dust as American students typically have the same median ability in these subjects as Central American countries like Honduras and Guatemala.
5:10 am on July 25th, 2010 8
Sorry, this story means absolutely nothing to me. Sure some of the teachers suck, that's the same anywhere. But I can tell you the students in D.C. especially in South East D.C. have little if any ability to learn. They are stupid, have no motivation to learn, no ability to learn and if they are lucky they join the US Army rise to the rank of CSM and are assigned to Walter Reed where they are charged with falsifying their service record.
You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
6:16 pm on July 25th, 2010 9
"But at the same time I also see the various pay-for-performance schemes as inadvertently pushing good teachers away from the schools or classrooms where such kids are more likely to be, because of the risk that even their quality performance will not be enough for them to hit all the right notes for them to qualify for the pay-for-performance incentives."
…or even that their quality performance isn't enough to ensure they won't be fired.
One of the first thing I learned when I studied to be a teacher was to recognize that there are affective factors that are beyond my control, to recognize the student's expectations. Well, I also learned that you can provide all the feedback, or input, you want to the students, it won't change that they ultimately control the intake. In other words, with some students it's in one ear out the other no matter what you do. Threatening teachers with dismissal won't ever change that.
6:19 pm on July 25th, 2010 10
"She is a product of Ohio public schools, private college prep schools and the Ivy League."
So, are you suggesting she wants inner-city public schools to be like Dead Poets Society?
6:33 pm on July 25th, 2010 11
"But I can tell you the students in D.C. especially in South East D.C. have little if any ability to learn. "
That's taking it a bit too far. I'm sure some are very smart and do want to learn.
12:51 am on July 26th, 2010 12
Maybe you should visit S.E. DC before you comment.
1:16 am on July 26th, 2010 13
You can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear.
Which is why it is pointless for anyone to try to cure you of your racism and bigotry, Lemmy.
1:31 am on July 26th, 2010 14
Hans Brinker wrote:
More important issues? That’s pretty vague.
Not vague at all. I'm talking about traditional curriculum, especially related to mastery of actual math and science that will help people in the real world. That gets lost when teachers are teaching to the tests in order to save their jobs and ensure funds for their schools.
In the D.C. public school system, I daresay “more important issues” for this demographic of teachers ranges from ‘how to make you jerri™-curls stick after an all-night bender,” to “how to improve your chances of getting ‘Section 8′,” to “how to avoid getting busted for dealing or using crack/meth amphetamines/your candy of choice.”
I've never been to DC, but I did grow up in the Compton area, and your racist characterization is so far off as to be absurd.
And that’s a cheap shot and a false analogy to compare the D.C. educational system under Chancellor Rhee with the Korean educational system. First of all, Michelle Rhee is not a product of the Korean education system.
Cheap shot? You saw my remark on the Korean educational system, you connected the dot to Michelle Rhee being Korean-American, and you assumed I was superficially tying her Koreanness to the worst thing I could imagine in Korean schools.
Well, given your racist characterization above, it's hardly surprising you would draw such simple-minded conclusions. In fact, my comment about "the worst aspects of the Korean educational system" had nothing to do with Ms Rhee's background, but everything to do with my concern that facile solutions like an ever-increasing over-reliance no standardized test-taking to determine merit (à la the SAT, GRE, and now No Child Left Behind) leads to a situation where people in schools are obsessed with test-taking and test results instead of actual learning outcomes. IOW, the worst aspects of the Korean educational system, something which Korean parents and students constantly bemoan.
Cheap shot, my arse. And I've said the same thing about ETS and No Child Left Behind for years, completely irrespective of Ms Rhee's involvement in the issue. No surprised a bigot sees bigotry in others.
5:08 am on July 26th, 2010 15
There is no evidence that Chancellor Rhee is promulgating school reforms based on "teaching to the tests." In fact, not only are you jumping to conclusions in your assumption that if certain standards are articulated teachers will automatically start "teaching to the test," I daresay you are projecting. (Only substandard teachers who don't have anything to offer would literally interpret higher standards into teaching to the test. Achieving classroom goals should never get in the way of effective teaching, as they are not mutually exclusive. For someone like you, however, who probably wastes students time by talking about how you got 'totally wasted last weekend,' articulated standards would indeed get in the way of your classroom management.) And FYI, calling a spade a spade is not tantamount to bigotry. I neither called you nor anyone else a bigot, so you are being quite the hypocrite — and projecting nonetheless — by your accusing me of being a bigot. (Takes one to know one, indeed!) That said, I personally don't have any firsthand experience in inner-city schools, but you don't need to. This country's dismal performance in standardized math and science exams compared with other countries is — in and of itself — a telling indictment of our current educational system that has lost its ability to prepare its charges for competition of the real world.
10:02 am on July 26th, 2010 16
"a telling indictment of our current educational system that has lost its ability to prepare its charges for competition of the real world."
We shouldn't prepare most of our children for success.
We should prepare them for failure… as that is what will happen to many of them.
The old "everyone is special" and "you are all going to be rock stars and millionaires" mentality rather discredited these days.
10:44 am on July 26th, 2010 17
The system works as designed, and quite well actually.
12:09 pm on July 26th, 2010 18
Kushibo 14 is "talking about traditional curriculum, especially related to mastery of actual math and science that will help people in the real world. "
Should kids learn how to solve quadratic equations? Simultaneous linear equations? Should they learn Newton's law of gravity? How about Einstien's law of gravity, which is acutally necessary for the GPS system? Should kids learn the theory, and the facts, of evolution? Should they learn the reality of anthropogenic climate change? Should they learn the theory and practice of the neutron-induced nuclear fission chain reaction? People talk about science and math, and I wonder just what they mean.
12:28 pm on July 26th, 2010 19
Glans…
How about they learn the fundamentals of math and science and the way of thinking that accompanies their successful application… so, later, if the more complex examples you cited are presented to them, their relationship to the workings of the universe is intuitively clear.
Too many students graduate from high school (and university) unable to clearly express their thoughts in written or spoken English, unable to quickly solve basic life-problems with pre-algebra math and unable to understand the consequences of their actions due to a lack of basic chemistry or physics education.
Some of these people post here.
12:28 pm on July 26th, 2010 20
I don't care what they learn so long as they become critical thinkers and not robots, which is exactly what they're becoming today. Again, there is nothing wrong with the system because it works as designed, and if you don't understand, well.
6:41 pm on July 26th, 2010 21
ChickenHead 19, quadratic equations and Newton's law of gravity are pretty basic. Our place in nature (we are apes!) is pretty basic, too. So do kids need to know these things? The more complicated subject of nuclear fission will help kids to evaluate statements and denials about weapons of mass destruction, so maybe kids should learn about that, too.
If kids are going to understand global warming, won't they need to know something about the carbon dioxide molecule and infrared radiation? Visible light goes right through carbon dioxide, I've seen it. But liberal scientists, trying to get government grants, say carbon dioxide absorbs infrared light. Is that possible?
6:47 pm on July 26th, 2010 22
GLANS #21
I disagree. Should one know something about medical procedure in detail in order to be able to know when to seek medical treatment? No.
Your logic in #21 isn't logical.
7:07 pm on July 26th, 2010 23
Advanced education is broke.
Unneeded math and science, a joke.
Good schooling is quick,
with just this one trick,
"Would you like a large fries with your Coke?"
12:49 am on July 27th, 2010 24
"Should kids learn how to solve quadratic equations? Simultaneous linear equations? Should they learn Newton’s law of gravity? How about Einstien’s law of gravity, which is acutally necessary for the GPS system? Should kids learn the theory, and the facts, of evolution? Should they learn the reality of anthropogenic climate change? Should they learn the theory and practice of the neutron-induced nuclear fission chain reaction? People talk about science and math, and I wonder just what they mean."
Well, we did…Well, not anthropogenic climate change. I'm not that young. And the basics of nuclear fission was discussed.
1:03 am on July 27th, 2010 25
…Heck, our physics teacher wasn't content with teaching that E = mc^2, he taught us the whole thing.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_in_special_rela…
4:11 am on July 27th, 2010 26
Just reading the comments and noticed something interesting. Kushibo went directly to race issues and bigotry on post 13 and 14. A first and foremost issue for him?
I like #16. Good insight.
5:44 am on July 27th, 2010 27
27 kushibo, I went back and checked #8. Lemmy never wrote anthing about "predominantly black". Nor did he mention anything about Jeri curls.
So it's back on you. Go back and read it again. Maby it's another comment. Cause it isn't #8.
From what I read, you're still the first one to pull the race card.
But putting all that aside for a moment, I've never been to this North Long Beach area. You said it wasn't the kids. You said it wasn't the teachers. What was it?
Again, in #8 Lemmy said nothing about race, nor did he say anything about hair styles. I'm not throwing stones. I'm just curious how you got to race and bigotry when Lemmy might simply have been relating what he saw, first hand.
I just went back and looked at it for the 3rd time. Still nothing about race or hair styles.
He did mention a CSM (who IS black), but that is as close as he got. Not lemmy's fault the CSM is black and a failure. Still no mention of race or hair.
5:59 am on July 27th, 2010 28
What a defeatist and nihilistic view of life you have. Pandering to de minimus standards of educational attainment under that rationale that most of these kids will probably end up a statistic anyway is not the purpose of education.
Recognizing that there are more than nine different types of intelligence, however, is one way educational systems can harness the power of teaching while recognizing the uniqueness of an individual student who may or may not fit into the cookie-cutter mold of traditional higher education.
For starters, our educational system should be diverse enough and farsighted enough to accommodate different educational tracks to success. Tracking students at an early age — usually before middle school, as they do in Europe — is one way we can ensure success in our educational system. Our current tracking system doesn't work, b/c parents of kids are put on a "non-college track" will invariably complain and pressure schools to put them on a college track. This is reasonable recognizing that most vocational tech programs in the U.S. are just glorified baby-sitting services. We need to create a mult-track system of educational attainment and success in this country. One of the ways we can do this is by patterning our system on Germany's own, where less than 19% of students ever attend university. The German system harnesses the skills and ability of the majority of their students through "Hauptfach" or typically three-year post-secondary apprenticeships, where they combine some classroom work with hands-on on-the-job apprenticeships in industry, whether it be manufacturing, technology or the service industry. The Germans have had much success with the apprenticeship system, which dates back to medieval times when the trades formed guilds and trained up young apprentices under the tutelage of master crafstmen. Currently, they've continue this tradition by having created viable joint public-private apprenticeships in technical fields, as well as the traditional trades. I don't see any reason why the U.S. couldn't duplicate this type of multi-track apprenticeship system. All it takes is the cooperation of the public and private sector to create the opportunities.
OK — so if the kids were not at fault, and the teachers are not at fault, then who is at fault? Is it the fault of the taxpayers in the community who consistently vote down paying higher property taxes that their richer neighbors to the south in OC have little or no problem paying every year?
Or is the "system" that is unfairly oppressing inner-city school systems as just another way of keeping 'em down? At the end of the day, people pay for what is important, and suffice it to say, sometimes paying for Jheri™ curls and crack cocaine takes precedence over anything and everything else, to include education, groceries, urban improvement, etc. (And please don't take my usage of "Jheri curls" literally. In this and previous references, "Jheri curls" is a metaphor for the afro-centric patterns of consumption, behavior, thought, and prioritization of life objectives vis-a-vis their unique subculture and recent history.)
6:02 am on July 27th, 2010 29
Retired GI wrote:
27 kushibo, I went back and checked #8. Lemmy never wrote anthing about “predominantly black”.
Come on, Retired GI, you're smarter than that. He cited a predominantly Black neighborhood (i.e., southeast DC) where…
So there, the largest Black population in a District that is already predominantly Black.
Nor did he mention anything about Jeri curls.
So it’s back on you. Go back and read it again. Maby it’s another comment. Cause it isn’t #8.
Sorry. I realized after I hit SUBMIT that I forgot to make clear the Jheri curl comment was in #7.
From what I read, you’re still the first one to pull the race card.
Read again, then.
But putting all that aside for a moment, I’ve never been to this North Long Beach area. You said it wasn’t the kids. You said it wasn’t the teachers. What was it?
For some reason, the city and county governments just utterly neglected those neighborhoods. The schools were rundown and our books were ancient. We lacked materials. The kids who came to school wanted to learn, and a lot of the teachers were good. But even the bad teachers wanted to be better teachers, even if they didn't know how. Back in high school I went back to look up some old teachers and I got the impression there wasn't much of a budget for further teacher training, but I don't know if there is in OC either.
There were probably a lot of parents who weren't good guides for their kids either, although in our circle of family friends, there weren't any like that. The criminal element at that time tended not to have kids in school.
The Black residents who could afford it got the hell out of Dodge as soon as they could, but a lot were stuck there, because, thanks to redlining, Blacks in Black neighborhoods were lowering their property values just by being there, no matter what they were doing for a living.
6:26 am on July 27th, 2010 30
Hans Brinker 29, what science and math do the Hauptfach kids learn?
8:42 am on July 27th, 2010 31
Hans Brinker,
"We should prepare them for failure… as that is what will happen to many of them."
I was being a smartazz… but there is a disturbing ember of truth to what I said.
(also to Glans)
Here is the deal. The world has changed rapidly… and many institution, including the educational system, has not caught on.
With globalization, the workforce has also been globalized.
Profitable companies requiring unskilled labor for high value-added manufacturing are going quickly. This means unskilled/uneducated workers are competing with a Chinese or Indian guy who will work for dollars a day.
That leaves the service sector.
Call centers, fast food drive-throughs and the like, are quickly being moved overseas to a cheaper and increasingly educated globalized workforce.
And what about labor?
Well, for every crap job, there is an illegal Mexican lined up to do it cheaper.
Reasonably good blue collar job… from electrician to plumber to firefighter… are increasingly requiring a good deal of math and science.
So what's left?
Deflation of wages for low-level American workers? A welfare state?
Those who can't produce are destined to fail.
10:13 am on July 27th, 2010 32
It depends on what kind of apprenticeship they're doing, but realize that in a German apprenticeship program, these people have already graduated from high school, or what they call "Realschule", and have already completed the formal classroom part of their education. As most apprentices in a three-year Hauptfach program are between the ages of 18-21, their purpose and endeavor is not achieve a classroom type theory-based education where they listen to lectures, work on problems, write papers, do projects and other things that uni students do, but rather to learn the basics and fundamentals of whatever trade they're apprenticing in, then, go out and do it eight hours a day under the supervision of professionals in a company that has signed an agreement with the government to provide paid vocational training for a minimum period of time — usually three years — for apprentice/hauptfach student. If a specific field requires any classroom time, usually it may be with apprentices from many different trades or fields, meeting for evening classes like once a month, where they might discuss, for example, how to manage your finances or how to apply for government services, etc., practical stuff like that. The Germans, being inherently practical, do not waste time trying to teach workers things they don't need to know. On the other hand, anyone who completes a three-year Hauptfach/apprenticeship can command respect in terms of competitive wages and recognition from the community at large who values not just college-educated workers, but skilled craftsmen and service workers.
10:16 am on July 27th, 2010 33
ChickenHead 32, what basic science and math do blue-collar workers need? I'm trying to figure out what should be required, what the standards should be. Certain subjects fascinate me, but I see a lot of people living pretty well without them.
10:23 am on July 27th, 2010 34
Great idea Hans!! Let's tell a kid when he's 12 that the only thing this life has to offer him is being a plumber or a factory worker (nothing wrong either one of those jobs by the way). GREAT idea!!!
I think I'm going to throw up.
10:35 am on July 27th, 2010 35
How silly and narrow minded you are. Are those the only "trades" you can think of? You really need to travel the world, especially in Europe and Asia to realize that countries like Germany and Japan are able to command some of the highest per capita GDPs in the industrialized world while having significantly fewer college-educated grads in the workforce than our country. How do they do it? By giving workers control the basic education, providing them with no-bullshit real skill training, and enabling them to have control over their careers and destiny. You can't achieve this with a one-size fits all education that caters to either the lowest common denominator, or excludes those who aren't college material. There has to be a healthy inbetween.
10:58 am on July 27th, 2010 36
I've traveled the world aplenty, including Germany, and althuogh it's a beautiful place with alot of beautiful people there's just something wrong, in my humble opinion of course, with putting limitations like that on kids at such an early age. People are more than just productive capacity for the state (bricks in the wall if you will), but maybe that's just me.
So, you are saying that telling a kid at the ripe age of 12 that he's going to be a blue collar worker for the rest of his life gives him control over his career and destiny?
11:00 am on July 27th, 2010 37
Kushibo, I've never been to DC. It could be lilly white for all I knew. Tho I have heard it isn't. But I didn't know.
I went back to #7 and saw what you referred too. While it does mention a certain demographic and the hair thing, I still don't see that as racist in and of itself.
There is not a doubt about what group. But, is he 100% wrong? I'm not saying all white teachers are good or competent even. But, was he wrong? My experience says he isn't. I have a friend (just happens to be black) who told me about his wife (who I assume is black also) who retired out of the army and got a job at the post office. She was given 20% disability for her back. I got 10% for my knee. He was laughing about it and said she is now up to 60%. Her "goal" is to reach 100%.
I have not attempted to increase mine. (Maybe I'm the Dumbasss). I know whites that do this also. My point is this; Just how wrong can Hans be?
Just because it refers to blacks in a negative light, who seem to be the Majority in DC, being the Majority it seems he has a good shot at being right.
Sterotypes get started for a reason. They don't pop out of thin air. If you say "Redneck", most people think of a really fat white guy with little education.
If you say "trailer trash", you don't think of a black person. These whites mirror their sterotypes. Only fair and equal to think the same of black sterotypes. They exist in every race, and do so for a reason. It may not be kind or P.C. or even civilized. But that doesn't make it racist or bigotry.
Don't shut people down from talking about it. Remove the REASON they talk about it. Yea, I know. Not gonna happen. (Eric Holder)
But being called racist is getting so old that it carries less and less power. If you disagree with the POTUS your called a racist! It is now just a way to attempt to shut people up. Whites are starting to shrug their shoulders when it happens, and say, "so what else is new. If you don't agree with them, they call you a racist."
Sometimes you don't have to do anything to be called a racist. Just be white and shave your head because you don't have much left, and you will be accused.
11:37 am on July 27th, 2010 38
Retired GI wrote:
Just reading the comments and noticed something interesting. Kushibo went directly to race issues and bigotry on post 13 and 14. A first and foremost issue for him?
Responding to race issues and bigotry, Retired GI, not the one introducing the subject into the discussion.
Or did you miss the reference to students in a predominantly Black area who “have little if any ability to learn” in #8 or “this demographic of teachers” being more concerned with their Jheri curls than with teaching?
But you are right that it is an important issue to me. I did go to a predominantly Black school in a predominantly Black neighborhood (Compton and North Long Beach area) and it was clear when we moved (to a far better equipped school in OC) why the school was failing and it was not the kids who were at fault. And none of the teachers were more concerned with their Jheri curls, not even the Black ones.
4:01 pm on July 27th, 2010 39
Glans,
"what basic science and math do blue-collar workers need?"
Excellent question.
The lowest level of blue collar workers need very little… so, if that is your point, you can feel comfort in your correctness.
But, in a globalized workforce, American students that have no understanding of math and science will be competing with equally-uneducated third-world workers for the blue collar jobs that require little education.
…and the lowest-paid worker will win.
…meaning there is a shrinking pool of well-paying jobs for workers without any of that fancy book-learning.
Low-level construction workers and landscapers need only some basic math skills… but, to advance, they will need a reasonably good understanding of topography and geometry… e.g. calculating perimeters and areas of irregular shapes, calculating angles, etc.
A real electrician will need algebra skills for calculating unknown values in sizing power systems… and phase calculations are much easier with a good understanding of trig.
Plumbers need algebra and geometry to calculate flow rates, pipe diameters and any number of other variables in an installation. Calculus is very handy to calculate cumulative volumes with changing flow rates or calculating instantaneous capacities… or maximums and minimums based off of modeling equations.
The list goes on.
Sure, a guy planting bushes, installing wall plugs or unplugging sewer lines for minimum wage doesn't need these skills… but those are dead-end jobs with a growing pool of willing workers… and they are the type of jobs I was referring to when I suggested more kids need to be prepared for failure.
Basic math and science exposure and understanding might be the difference between a lifetime of pounding nails into 2x4s… and supervising a group of guys doing it because you have the ability to solve problems instantly without having to call the Asian guy back at the home office.
5:19 pm on July 27th, 2010 40
Hans Brinker 33, so they study science and mathematics in Realschule before they begin Hauptfach?
I remember my German teacher, many years ago. She was a bright young woman and knew lots about German literature, said that she spoke French and Spanish, and, I can tell you, she spoke American English very well. But she knew nothing of science. Our textbook gave "red-hot coals" as a translation for "glühende Kohlen" and she disagreed – it just meant glowing and said nothing about red. She didn't know that glowing coals are necessarily red, even though Planck discovered his radiation law in her hometown of Berlin! A line in a story that we read puzzled her – the sunlight shining through a beveled window cast colors on the wall. She had apparently never heard of Newton's experiments with prisms, never seen it for herself. And later it emerged that she didn't understand how the Earth's position in its orbit causes the seasons. She was wonderful, and I admired her, but I was amazed that an educated German could be ignorant of subjects in which her nation excelled. Maybe she got tracked at an early age.
5:28 pm on July 27th, 2010 41
ChickenHead 39, it sounds like tradesmen need the traditional high-school mathematics curriculam, plus calculus if they can get it. Here's a mathematics achievment test for the entire ROK Drop community, to prove that you're worthy to measure school children. Multiply 0.9765625 * 1.024 without a calculator.
3:00 am on July 29th, 2010 42
If D.C. can't get their act together, and if some Americans find European-style educational tracking too stifling, then D.C. needs to look at school systems that work and copy it. That said, we need to look at the high school I attended in the northern suburbs of Chicago and start asking ourselves — as do hundreds of educators and high school administrators from districts all over the country who visited our school ask themselves, "Why does this school work while ours doesn't?"
1) High property tax. (Stable economic base ensures continuous and stable stream of non-stop funding for competitive teachers' salaries, first-class programs, first-rate facilities, etc.
2) High median property values. (High median property values in the suburubs of Chicago ensures a community of like-minded parents and children who are focused on educational attainment, community values and upper-middle-class career success.)
3) High standards for students. (Unlike most high schools, the high school I attended upped the ante for high school graduation standards in the state. So instead of three years of math, they demanded four; instead two years of a foreign language, they demanded four; instead of three years of history, they demanded four, etc.
4) High standards for teachers. (Teachers are able to command higher-than-average salaries in our district b/c the district only hires the cream of the crop. Anyone with less than a Master's degree need not apply.)
Results: Out of a student body of some 4,100 students at my high school, the breakdown is usually 75% white, 20% Asian, 3% Hispanic, 2.5% Other, 0.4% Black. There has been no "white flight" in this community for over 100 years, as this is about as far North as you can get away from Chicago city limits without being in Wisconsin.
3:30 am on July 29th, 2010 43
I agree with #42 Hand B.
I know someone who lived through California Proposition 13 (1978) while in High school in CA. He said the year after it was passed, practically all after school programs in his school disappeared.
I agree with GOP, Libertarian etc etc cutting/controlling tax to a certain degree. But to cut funding for education is the STUPIDEST thing to do. It's worse than betraying your country by handing over nukes to talibans/alqaeda/NK/Iraq.
2:11 am on August 8th, 2010 44
No math education's arranged.
Just diversity and cultural exchange.
Now job prospects are killed
because I'm not skilled.
I can make hope but not change.
7:20 am on August 8th, 2010 45
Everybody here can comment on the math standards for kids, but nobody here can multiply 0.9765625 * 1.024 without a calculator.
8:43 am on August 8th, 2010 46
Glans… dude.
The answer was self-evident… no doubt, for many… but there seemed no point in saying, "That was too easy!"
Granted, without suspecting a "trick" answer, I might have puzzled over it for more than a second… but as one number is roughly 2.5% less than 1 and the other number is about 102.5% more than 1, the exact answer was rather easy to reason out… truly, within a second.
8:56 pm on September 14th, 2010 47
Now that Washington D.C. mayor Fenty has been defeated in the recent election, it's not likely Michelle will receive the same support from his successor. She will probably not be kept on long enough to see any of her plans go through.
Would anybody be surprised if Obama appointed her to a position?