By Here is a letter to the editor that I saw in the Army Times recently that I think those of you stationed in Korea or heading to Korea may find of interest:
Soldiers stationed in South Korea with sponsorship orders allow the soldier to bring his family along, with the attempt to reduce the hardships of being apart. Before arriving in Korea, the US military advertised that spouse employment would be in abundance; with this promise a lot of spouses resigned from their previous jobs to along side their soldiers in Korea. I jumped on the bandwagon as well and quit my job, but to my surprise, after being in Korea for six months, I joined a vast amount of other spouses who could not find employment and felt that the US military misled the families.
Lack of US spouse employment is not due to the lack of education or experience; many have bachelor’s and master’s degrees but are not still able to find a job because they do not speak Korean, or the posted jobs on Civilian Personnel Online are manipulated by current employees intending to hire friends. Soldiers and family members frequently complain about the level of service due to people speaking broken English and not fully understanding what soldiers’ and family members’ needs are. Imagine a soldier with pay problems, housing issues, etc. trying to explain in layman’s terms what the problems is. It almost seems that services are geared more toward Korean nationals who come on post rather than US soldiers who reside on post. I believe soldiers and families are receiving inadequate treatment and services because of the lack of support by the US military in Korea.
It appears to taking a toll on a lot of families with spouses whose livelihood depends on two incomes. Spouses who are frustrated and simply tired of being told “no” are returning home earlier than expected and having to attend family group meetings in the attempt to ease the tensions. I know I was irritated when I was eliminated after an interview that prevented me from even being an ID card checker in a facility although I possess a bachelor’s of science in information systems. My case is one of many in Korea, and the spouses and soldiers are simply asking for equal and fair hiring practices and opportunities.
Gregory Pugh
Daegu, South Korea [Army Times]
You have got to love the whinging of the new guys. First all let me just say that Mr. Pugh if he did some research prior to coming to Korea he should have come across my many prior postings discussing the difficulties surrounding the hiring of spouses in USFK.
With that said let me point out that in my opinion the US military does not owe a military spouse a job. I believe the US military should assist when possible to help a spouse find work, but their shouldn’t be an expectation which is clearly the case with Mr. Pugh that the US military owes you a job. A sure way to ensure the US military finds Mr. Pugh employment would be by enlisting himself into the service.
Let me also say that Koreans do not owe spouses a job either, especially in economic times like this where many Koreans cannot find a job. Because of all of this it is going to continue to be difficult to find employment for spouses in Korea due to language differences and the fact that many jobs are reserved for Koreans per the SOFA. Additionally what jobs are available for non-Koreans will be difficult for someone who is only in country a year or two before PCSing again when employers like to have some long term stability in their work force. That is why I have always thought that spouses with degrees should try and get their visa status modified to work as English teachers. This is a profession that is already reliant on a transient work force and continues to have a strong demand for more teachers.
8:00 pm on August 11th, 2010 1
For Sale: ocean front property in Arizona.
"the US military advertised that spouse employment would be in abundance" Show me this advertisement.
You should not need 2 incomes to support your family. If you do, you're not supporting your family, you're supporting your lifestyle.
10:31 pm on August 11th, 2010 2
Spouses are already teaching English with a blind eye being turned by authorities on post. Oh, and check out all the little Korean kids getting conversational English. Kaching!
10:35 pm on August 11th, 2010 3
…at the Dragon Hill Lodge.
10:57 pm on August 11th, 2010 4
Rokdrop…i think you're totally missing the point here. why would someone with a well earned degree in a specific area want to teach english? you have got to admit that the guy notes certain realities here in korea. not that anyone owes this guy anything, but come on, seriously?
11:27 pm on August 11th, 2010 5
You should not need 2 incomes to support your family. If you do, you’re not supporting your family, you’re supporting your lifestyle.
Nailed it! sounds like entitlement syndrome to me. You can tell that this cat failed to do any meaningful research.
11:42 pm on August 11th, 2010 6
Uh: "why would someone with a well earned degree in a specific area want to teach english?"
When I lived in Korea I taught English, and I had two bachelors degrees. One in chemistry (with microbiology/math minors), and the other medical technology. Teaching English was a great experience…and one that taught me a lot more about social intelligence/communication/cultural awareness than anything I could ever learn in the classroom or medical laboratory. Very valuable skills to draw on for future employment, and you'll find that it's a point of interest to a lot of people. Or they could do what other spouses did and waste that experience and wish it all away for a year or two.
12:56 am on August 12th, 2010 7
It's probably the same reason why someone with a degree want to be an ID card checker.
3:36 am on August 12th, 2010 8
I'm surprised USFK spouses are not already teaching english at local public schools and hagwons.
#4
Someone with a well earned degree in a specific area should teach english if that is the best opportunity available. Why not?
Also, teacher should be a respected profession which it is in ROK. Not so in US imo.
5:56 am on August 12th, 2010 9
In many cases, military spouses are no more qualified to teach English to Korean children than a Canadian with a phony degree. If spouses have degrees, many are from the Universities of Phoenix or Maryland, which are just as valid and qualifying as Canadian scam degrees.
Even if the Koreans allowed them off-post employment, military spouses would receive much more scrutiny than any other foreigner seeking employment in Korea since they're covered by the SOFA.
6:21 am on August 12th, 2010 10
, "or the posted jobs on Civilian Personnel Online are manipulated by current employees intending to hire friends."
At least he got this one right.
8:21 am on August 12th, 2010 11
If they were told that employment would be abundant, then they have reason to be upset. Some of them gave up careers and jobs they enjoyed (yes, not everyone works just for the money, Lemmy and Jeff).
8:22 am on August 12th, 2010 12
…and women can have careers.
9:30 am on August 12th, 2010 13
I think it would be a great idea and mutually beneficial for spouses to teach English in Korea.
That said:
…many have bachelor’s and master’s degrees but are not still able to find a job…
A degree does not guarantee success. Being able to do a job is preferable. Common sense rocks! Degree inflation is fatiguing. Everybody has a degree… even me.
*yawn*
It almost seems that services are geared more toward Korean nationals who come on post rather than US soldiers…
Fairly observant. It's not going to change now or ever. Golf courses are a prime example and microcosm of what is wrong with how installations are operated in Korea.
posted jobs on Civilian Personnel Online are manipulated by current employees intending to hire friends.
Most people get jobs through other people. People want to hire people they know. It's called networking. Most of the good jobs require former military experience (and the applicable experience that comes with it) and a security clearance. As noted in the article, they also want someone who is going to be around longer than 9-18 months. A person can't complete all their sensitivity training, CBT's and other prerequisites in six months. I suggest the writer go back to school and earn his Phd. Perhaps that will help his career opportunities.
I've noticed MWR has become FMWR. While I agree families are of course important, it seems families are now more important than the actual service members themselves. They families seem to be superseding the soldiers, to the active duty members detriment, even in areas such as entertainment.
I think I'll stop here, the fumes are starting to make me light headed.
6:36 pm on August 12th, 2010 14
"I’ve noticed MWR has become FMWR. While I agree families are of course important, it seems families are now more important than the actual service members themselves. They families seem to be superseding the soldiers, to the active duty members detriment, even in areas such as entertainment."
Get used to it because it's only going to get worse. On another note, (personally I don't care because as far as I'm concerned, every bar could close today) – but for those of you who enjoy the ville, better take some pics because in the not-too-distant future, the ones outside Osan and Humphreys will be nothing but memories, from the way I hear it.
8:08 pm on August 12th, 2010 15
#14 What's the master plan this time. C'mon give us a taste. …and never forget them thar KOreans can be pretty crafty when it comes to the cheese.
8:39 pm on August 12th, 2010 16
The simple answer is yes. USFK is bound to provide high paying, executive level jobs for spouses who willingly relinquish jobs CONUS to follow thier Service Member spouse to Korea. In fact I think I read in Drudgereport today that jobs are a RIGHT! We must force our lap dogs into providing jobs for our spouses.
8:43 am on August 13th, 2010 17
Leon,
This is all second-hand info so take it with a grain of salt:
Osan: The plan is for the entire area from the Doolittle gate and over to the right all the way to near the AFOC gate, out to where the railroad tracks are to be torn down and to be replaced with high-rise apartments…and a big park to be built right about where most of the ville is now. There's opposition from the community (from what I was told, mainly from people who own homes with land) and also opposition from the military about having apartments over a certain height close to the base. So for now, that plan is on hold. I know a few people who have bought some of the old houses near the Capitol hotel, hoping to get rich when those neighborhoods get razed and they're starting to get a little worried that all of it may never happen…
Humphreys: The street in front of the main gate will be widened and the buildings within so many blocks will be torn down and replaced with apts.
I think there was a map of the plan for Songtan up at Kalani O'Sullivan's site but his site is down now.
10:10 am on August 13th, 2010 18
I see. But that just means the ville or elements of it will move, slide shuffle. There's too many Koreans addicted to the easy money and ancient business model. There will always be a 'ville' somewhere nearby.
11:07 am on August 13th, 2010 19
I agree. Plus, the bar and store owners have a lot of clout on and off base/post.
So in the end, poor Mary Ellen, pushing her strollers with her five kids may just have to be offended by the sleazy bars
10:09 am on August 14th, 2010 20
Just more people wanting entitlements over actually earning the job themselves. Being qualified for a job does not guarantee you that job nor does it mean your the ~most~ qualified of all applicants. According to the SOFA any job that does not specifically require a US citizen is to be given to a Korean National first and foremost. This clause is in almost every US related SOFA in the world so they better get used to it.
And the above posters are correct, the good paying jobs require a security clearance with four or more years of experience in that field, which is usually military related. I can count on one hand the number of spouses I've met that qualified for those jobs and they were all former military. This leaves them to compete with the local KN's for the rest, which most of those will go to the KN's by default. The jobs-for-spouses program will get no where because there is legally nothing that can be done due to preexisting agreements with the ROK.
11:53 am on August 14th, 2010 21
Most jobs require a security clearance and they give most of these jobs to KNs? Not if the job required a SECRET clearance. Let's not forget the DoD 8570 certification requirements for IT jobs.
9:06 am on August 15th, 2010 22
You misunderstood. Most of the high paying jobs require a security clearance, those don't come cheap. The DoD 8570 IT requirements are very open to interpretation because they rely on IT levels and job descriptions to code what is needed. Improper application of the word "management" leaves you with a helpdesk guy needing a CISSP but the PFC next to him doing the same job needs nothing (military service members are automatically waived the requirements at the local level).
The KN's get most of whats left over, which is all the non-US-Secret jobs. There ~are~ some jobs available for ROKUS-Secret, basically KN's with the Korean version of a Security clearance that can only access ROKUS systems. After all those are taken up, the diminishingly small remaining poll is allocated to spouses but most don't want that low of a job / pay.
11:16 am on August 18th, 2010 23
This isn't what you want to hear, but the schools always need substitute teachers ($101.00 per day). Mr. Pugh, nobody OWES you a job, and if someone promised you one for coming overseas, your BS meter should have started working overtime. It is frustrating looking for a job overseas, but if you are willing to settle (sorry, but if you want to work, sometimes you must), you could be working. I see they need cashiers at the commissary…
12:59 pm on August 23rd, 2010 24
Thanks for all the insight, sarcasm, information, and sheer enlightenment. I don’t recall stating that anyone owed me anything I have worked for what I have in my life but it’s clear that’s what everyone is presuming when all I asked for is a common ground and fair hiring practices. It’s amazing nowhere in my article I stated I was owed something but instead everyone attached themselves to the first response which was so appropriately addressed by insinuating someone was “whining”. Thanks for the suggestions but I have since found a job in my career field no thanks to fair hiring practices. Cut and dry if this sponsorship program is non-workable due to certain constraints “scrap it”. It’s not about me as I stated it’s about equal and fair practices, anyway it was nice hearing from everyone and briefly capturing everyone’s thoughts.
United States Forces Korea
http://www.usfk.mil/usfk/ShowContent.aspx?ID=406
2:06 pm on August 23rd, 2010 25
Equal and fair in USFK? When did you fall off that turnip truck?
*breath* 
7:41 am on November 24th, 2010 26
I don’t think the issue here is why spouses WANT to do the jobs overseas, but if they can find work. Also, there are many reasons someone wants to work which could include needing more money or simply enjoying working.