By After saying that the USS George Washington would participate in a naval exercise in the Yellow Sea the Pentagon has now come back and for a second time gave in to Chinese objections and scrapped those plans:
The USS George Washington aircraft carrier will not participate in the South Korea-U.S. antisubmarine drills scheduled to take place in the Yellow Sea early next month.
The two nations’ Combined Forces Command announced the decision in a media release Friday but added that the supercarrier will be active in waters near the Korean Peninsula during future exercises.
The command said that the timetable for the antisubmarine drills is still in the planning stages and that a list of participating vessels will be announced next week. [KBS Global]
It is looking like total amateur hour at the Pentagon judging by these ever shifting press releases.
8:55 pm on August 22nd, 2010 1
This kowtowing is beginning to piss me off.
9:59 pm on August 22nd, 2010 2
But it appears that the exercises are still going on despite the GW's absence…so a semi-kowtow?
10:25 pm on August 22nd, 2010 3
Being wishy-washy like this sends a horrible message. If I was Japan or S. Korea I'd start building nukes.
10:34 pm on August 22nd, 2010 4
US is scared. Without the Chinese, US is done as nation as we know it.
This just about tells us Korea cannot rely on the weak US totally. It's time to seriously get the nuclear option to protect against the growing and haughty jjankes with big blown up egos.
10:53 pm on August 22nd, 2010 5
Tom. somehow I feel that, despite all your childish hatred for the US, if a war ever broke out in Korea, your ass will be hiding somewhere in the US. How sad that you won't be raising the red banners with your comrades in arms of China… an army might have needed a mad bull or two.
2:11 am on August 23rd, 2010 6
It isn't the Pentagon. The US military does what it's commander in chief tells it to.
K- Tom already fled once to the US during the financial crisis. He failed there as well. It might have had something to do with telling his American boss how much he hated Americans every day. Anyway that is my speculation, the fact is that Tom is an admitted two time loser.
2:50 am on August 23rd, 2010 7
OK, K and Hamilton.
Then tell me why the US, once again postponed the exercise? So it's not because of Chinese pressure and US weakness?
3:42 am on August 23rd, 2010 8
Then tell me why the US, once again postponed the exercise? So it’s not because of Chinese pressure and US weakness?
You are confusing an attempt to be diplomatic with weakness. Sadly, though, Beijing will also probably do the same.
5:22 am on August 23rd, 2010 9
Kushibo, you know what is even worse? Assuming American predictability. All it would take is another Presidential election and the kid gloves come off. Heck, sometimes it doesn't even take that. I can think of a couple times where a seemingly wussy or distracted administration sent a nice dose of white hot death onto some unsuspecting regime…
9:05 am on August 23rd, 2010 10
I doubt that the George Washington should be part of antisubmarine drills in the Yellow Sea, but someone who knows about naval tactics might want to offer a meaningful opinion. Still, common sense has to agree with GI Korea's statement, "It is looking like total amateur hour at the Pentagon judging by these ever shifting press releases."
10:37 am on August 23rd, 2010 11
you guys would make awesome foreign policy experts
(not.)
10:54 am on August 23rd, 2010 12
I'm actually a highly paid defense consultant, Koreapull.
12:18 pm on August 23rd, 2010 13
It is amateur hour and no doubt, the Chinese raised the stakes and made it clear that there would be a price to pay if by threatening the North Koreans we also threatened the Chinese with our naval exercises exercises. The confidence building measures that worked so well in Europe with the Russians and the Warsaw Pact in which we openly announced our intention to conduct large scale exercises off the Chinese coast,is not an effective model for dealing with North Korea or China. It's not seen as a confidence building measure but as a threatening gesture- which it is.
Unfortunately after the Cold War ended, too many unemployed Kremlin experts and European arms control negotiators refocused their attention on North Korea and China with dismal results. And what is the value of exercising in the Yellow/West Sea? Would we really park an aircraft carrier in the West Sea during war with North Korea? I'm not a naval warfare expert but it doesn't seem like a good use of an aircraft carrier and if that isn't how we would fight, why exercise that way and totally piss off the Chinese? There are a lot of good reasons to piss off the Chinese and a lot of places to do it but my guess is after the GW steamed home, the ROKs would pay a hefty price and the long term result would not necessarily be closer ROK – US relations. So what will the US gain with this exercise and why didn't anyone ask these questions on the front side?
My guess is the Chinese turned up the heat on both the Blue House and the White House and someone at the Pentagon or the NSC finally slapped their forehead Homer Simpson style, went "Doh," and called this off.
2:35 pm on August 23rd, 2010 14
The Pentagon is a huge structure with a huge opening in the middle. That is where the giant tampon needs to be.
4:23 pm on August 23rd, 2010 15
You may recall that aircraft carriers operated in the Yellow Sea during the Korean War, given the many lucrative targets along the western coast of the peninsula, and the value in terms of fuel economy, transit time, etc. to strike these from the Yellow Sea.
As for the value of a carrier's participation in antisubmarine drills in the Yellow Sea today, it has some benefit from an offensive/defensive practice point of view, especially given the shallow nature of this body of water and the unique challenges this presents in ASW warfare.
As for why China is so vociferous on these exercioses, there are possibly many reasons, one of which is China's own submarine force, possibly an SSBN bastion strategy – see this for more info:
http://www.strategycenter.net/research/pubID.60/p…
4:59 pm on August 23rd, 2010 16
Pops 15, is a carrier in the Yellow Sea a difficult target for land-based missiles?
5:34 pm on August 23rd, 2010 17
Glans, it is a very difficult target for nK missiles. However, the chinese are fielding an extended range missile that may be a game changer. Performance of said missle versus hype is hard to calculate.
5:36 pm on August 23rd, 2010 18
At 16, Glans. Depends on who you are talking about. And a lot of other factors, everything from command and control efficiency and effectiveness, target detection capability, tracking, defenses available on or with the carrier, type of missile, etc., etc., etc. The answer is a solid maybe, closely followed by a definite possibly, but this is unconfirmed.
4:06 pm on August 25th, 2010 19
I wish the US would quit kissing the a$$ of every f'ing country in the world. I'm no expert on naval tactics but if the pentagon originally wanted to have the USS George Washington participate in the naval exercise then obviously it was important for the ship to be there. This a$$ kissing just makes us look weak. We should have told the Red Chinese to f'off and deploy the ship in the Yellow Sea. The Soviets used to bellyache when we sent naval vessels to the Black Sea, we wisely just ignored their complaints. These are international waters, period. I tend to agree with Tom on one point, if I were in the SK government I believe that it would be in the interest of SK to go nuclear. If NK attacked I would turn Pyongyang into a glow in the dark parking lot. With Red China becoming more aggressive I think there is a very good chance that SK, Japan, Taiwan, & maybe Vietnam may go nuclear. India is of course already a nuclear power.
6:27 pm on November 28th, 2010 20
[...] planned this year, we backed off and kept George Washington out of the area (see here and here). Perhaps Team Obama is now using the Yellow Sea threat as leverage with the Chinese to get them to [...]
6:37 pm on November 28th, 2010 21
[...] planned this year, we backed off and kept George Washington out of the area (see here and here). Perhaps Team Obama is now using the Yellow Sea threat as leverage with the Chinese to get them to [...]
1:15 pm on November 5th, 2011 22
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1:48 pm on November 5th, 2011 23
WTF is “elnightennemt”?
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9:22 pm on November 5th, 2011 24
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2:58 am on November 9th, 2011 25
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