By Not only is the South Korean island getting a new airport built, but now even a naval base is going to be built as well:
According to the Hanguk Ilbo, the ROK Navy has decided to build a naval base at Sadong Harbor on Ulleung-do. The base, scheduled for completion in 2015, will be able to accommodate the largest of Korea’s warships, including the ROKS Dokdo and its Aegis destroyers, and will allow Korea to respond more quickly to a conflict with Japan over Dokdo. Previously, it took Korean warships over four hours to steam from Uljin and Donghae to Dokdo, while Japanese warships could reach the islets in 2 hours, 49 minutes from the Oki Islands. [Marmot's Hole]
She hasn’t seen...
8:07 pm on September 28th, 2011 1
Why not just agree to split Dokdo (or whatever you want to call it) down the middle? Right half goes to Japan and left half to Korea?
9:09 pm on September 28th, 2011 2
@Mikesaw If someone knocked on your door and said they want your house and land would you just say fair enough lets split it 50/50?
9:55 pm on September 28th, 2011 3
Like the Japanese are really going to invade Dokdo. Seriously? It’s a non-starter. Some of these Korean and Japanese politicians are real children (much like our own politicians). This is all smoke and mirrors to distract the populous from real issues (also much like we suffer from our silly ass pols). The Koreans already have a small permanent base there. But whatever. Pour some more tax Won into this fiasco.
10:27 pm on September 28th, 2011 4
Yet another of 2MBs wasteful construction projects.
10:31 pm on September 28th, 2011 5
For your information Teadrinker, 2MB is one of the least military-supportive president in Korea’s history.
11:05 pm on September 28th, 2011 6
#5,
What’s that got to do with is penchant for putting money in the pockets of construction firms?
1:44 am on September 29th, 2011 7
What penchant for putting money in the pockets of construction firms, that dock is barely going to cost $80 million a year to construct from now, and most of it for salaries, which means the money is not lost. It’s big enough to station only one frigate and some patrol craft permanently at any given time. The destroyers and flattops can dock there, but not stationed. It’s a very small naval base of limited usefulness in force projection, the minimum required to maintain presence in that part of the sea.
Why don’t you call Japan’s stationing of much bigger airbases and naval bases that actually do permanently station a huge fleet of F-15J/DJs and destroyers in the Oki islands equally stupid and wasteful? They have even less chance of being attacked by an enemy than Ulleung island.
3:38 am on September 29th, 2011 8
“It’s a very small naval base of limited usefulness in force projection, the minimum required to maintain presence in that part of the sea.”
Minimum required to maintain a presence in that part of the sea? You’re kidding, right? What about the Donghae and Pusan naval bases. Before you reply, look up the location of Canadian naval bases, paying close attention to the distance which separates them. You see, ships are funny…You don’t always have to keep them docked and they can float on water.
3:52 am on September 29th, 2011 9
“Why don’t you call Japan’s stationing of much bigger airbases and naval bases that actually do permanently station a huge fleet of F-15J/DJs and destroyers in the Oki islands equally stupid and wasteful?”
Because I don’t #@%$ing pay taxes in Japan!
4:09 am on September 29th, 2011 10
“Minimum required to maintain a presence in that part of the sea? You’re kidding, right? What about the Donghae and Pusan naval bases. Before you reply, look up the location of Canadian naval bases, paying close attention to the distance which separates them. You see, ships are funny…You don’t always have to keep them docked and they can float on water.”
All of Canada’s potential adversaries are an ocean away. Canadian forces benefit from greater early warning opportunity and preparation time because of that. Korea’s potential adversaries are mere hours of cruising distance away from Korea.
“Because I don’t #@%$ing pay taxes in Japan!
”
Have you ever thought of this – if the Japanese didn’t build bases in the Oki islands, maybe Koreans didn’t need to build bases in Ulleung islands with your… taxpayer’s money. They also build the base with my taxpayer’s money too, by the way. I wonder why you are being so much a whiny pup about this completely ordinary military governance undertaking and I’m not. Well you don’t like the place, you don’t want to pay Korea taxes that it uses for defense, you can leave. Korea is not forcing you to stay.
4:29 am on September 29th, 2011 11
“Because I don’t #@%$ing pay taxes in Japan!
”
Translation: It’s OK for Japan to waste their money stationing fighters and naval ports to threaten Korea (no-one says a peep), but god forbid if Korea tries to put one little naval port to protect Korean territory – it’s terrible crime that threatens Japan – terrible Koreans who has history of invading Japan and subjugating them!
PS: I also paid taxes in Canada, but I never cared or whined and cried that taxes were going to waste for something stupid (and god knows Canada is a much more wasteful country than Korea), because it’s not my country to get involved in internal affairs.
7:38 am on September 29th, 2011 12
9:02 am on September 29th, 2011 13
USinKorea,
Teadrinker seems to have “gone native”…
…and that is EXACTLY THE WAY IT SHOULD BE.
Teadrinker is a Canadian and has interests in seeing Canada succeed.
But he is also a resident of Korea… and has sincere interests in Korea succeeding.
The world is big enough that one can wish for Canada and Korea to succeed at the same time…
…and, if for some reason, there is a conflict between Canada and Korea, Teadrinker is smart enough to choose the interests of the side that is right.
I truly wish all immigrants/residents, the world over, would act in the interest of both the country they came from and the the country they moved to… with a preference for the country that takes care of them best.
9:14 am on September 29th, 2011 14
‘But he is also a resident of Korea… and has sincere interests in Korea succeeding.”
I DOUBT THAT.
11:34 am on September 29th, 2011 15
#13
It’s possible because Canada and Korea are on the opposite sides of the globe. I bet Korea and Japan wouldn’t have so much issues with each other if they were a little more separated.
2:40 pm on September 29th, 2011 16
Does anyone seriously believe the positioning of the Japanese fleet is intended to be a threat or deterrence directed towards the SOUTH Koreans?
2:48 pm on September 29th, 2011 17
JoeC – Yes, that is certainly pat of their calculations. If Japan keeps up the claim that Dokdo islands really belong to them, it’s possible to end up with a compromise between Japan and South Korea where South Korea cedes some of its exclusive economic zone in exchange for Japan ceasing their claims to the islands.
3:25 pm on September 29th, 2011 18
“Does anyone seriously believe the positioning of the Japanese fleet is intended to be a threat or deterrence directed towards the SOUTH Koreans?”
Why not? As soon as the US out of Korea and out of Asia, Japan could be back to militarism in no time. Their defense spending is much higher than South Korea’s due to their GNP being bigger.
3:59 pm on September 29th, 2011 19
I capitalized the word SOUTH because, after North Korea, then maybe China and Russia, I don’t think South Korea ranks very high on Japan’s list of potential military adversaries. The first two also happen to be west of Japan.
4:10 pm on September 29th, 2011 20
Tom: “As soon as the US out of Korea and out of Asia, Japan could be back to militarism in no time.”
…and despite that, you still want the US to leave? Things didn’t work out too well for the Koreans the last time Japan got into their militarism.
I can’t imagine why… wait a minute… Oh, silly me, I see. Your family might have been Japanese collaborators and therefore benefited greatly. Now many of your posts make much more sense. Forgive me for being so dense.
5:02 pm on September 29th, 2011 21
#20. Just put it this way LaPorte but I’d rather put up with Japanese militarism than American whinings on “ungrateful Koreans”.
5:20 pm on September 29th, 2011 22
#11,
That’s it, ignore the facts of the argument, such as my mention of Donghae and Pusan naval bases, which are more than capable of dealing with any empty threats (real or imagined) coming from Japan and North Korea. How typical of you.
#14,
I voted during last elections. When was the last time you voted in a South Korean election?
#16,
Only those who ignore the fact that the Japanese military has been neutered by its constitution and, more importantly, the close ties both countries have. Clearly, any military base Japan builds is because they feel threatened by North Korea, to a certain extent, and China, to a greater one.
#18,
“Their defense spending is much higher than South Korea’s due to their GNP being bigger.”
…and? It only proves that things are expensive in Japan. You should be happy about that because it means South Korea can get more bang for its buck out of its military budget. Really, you can be incredibly illogical sometimes.
6:05 pm on September 29th, 2011 23
Where are the peace activists now?
8:34 pm on September 29th, 2011 24
“That’s it, ignore the facts of the argument, such as my mention of Donghae and Pusan naval bases, which are more than capable of dealing with any empty threats (real or imagined) coming from Japan and North Korea.”
You are not privileged to decide what is capable of and what is not capable of satisfying the defense needs of the Republic of Korea.
“The first two also happen to be west of Japan.”
Their naval routes come from Southwest and Northwest. There are many larger Japanese bases in Kyushu and Hokkaido, especially in Hokkaido where Japan has stationed its best armed armored divisions and air defenses, which China and Russia must expend a lot of their offensive force to break through. Only the naval routes of the two Koreas come directly from the West by Oki islands. These routes are considered strategically inconvenient places for China and Russia to mobilize from because of the presence of South Korean and American forces in close proximity – there’s a great expectation that China and Russia should they decide to bring conflict to Japan over some dispute will carry out their intent on the wider eastern sea of Japan instead of the closed western sea, to avoid being linchpined in engagement with Japanese, Korean, and American forces simultaneously. They’ll be used only if all their options of instrumentalizing the other safer routes have been completely exhausted. In support of my theory, I present my information that the western shore of Japan is much, much less fortified with defense forces (since the less dangerous Koreas are the only ‘likely’ forces to attack it) than the northwest, southwest, and the eastern shores of Japan which must contend with force projection capabilities of military superpowers.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_0HCJq6B1wZA/TGh2ww-ds2I/AAAAAAAACzI/wVZ6-3nCEQk/s1600/JAPSAMNETPATRIOT.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_0HCJq6B1wZA/TGh2spGd6pI/AAAAAAAACzA/dNc1YA-qSUk/s1600/JAPSAMNETHAWK.jpg
(I may have better sources of information to prove this, but these are the only disclosed ones of meaningful content)
Bases of the Oki islands are the relics of the day when the future of Japan-Korea relations still remained uncertain as much as, or perhaps even more than of the when Sino-Japan and Russo-Japan relations were bad. The base in the Ulleung island seem to soon become another one, but since the underlying issues that caused the base to be constructed weren’t as severe as Japan’s case for building the bases in Oki, it has been constructed to much lesser specification than the Japanese bases. Ulleung bases are about 1/100 the size and strength of the naval bases in Jinhae, Busan, and the recent one being separately constructed in Jeju, and their use is less as an apparatus for proper warfare than it is built as a symbolic political gesture to both the public and to diplomatic channels that Korea remains resolute in its rulership of Dokdo (on the other hand, bases of Oki islands are properly built for warfare), making Japan and its supporters less willing to continue pressing the matter for an outcome that favors Japan. The Korean leadership already have thought well in advance of how Japan will react to the base’s construction, and how they must re-react to Japan in kind to continue to maintain the strategic upper hand in their territorial dispute.
8:53 pm on September 29th, 2011 25
“You are not privileged to decide what is capable of and what is not capable of satisfying the defense needs of the Republic of Korea.”
Oh, the “I know you are but what am I” argument. I knew it would come sooner or later with you.
6:10 pm on September 30th, 2011 26
Waste of money when the elephant in the room is the PRC….
7:31 pm on September 30th, 2011 27
And the PRC has access to the East Sea, since they now have ships docked in North Korean waters. Why is it a waste of money? Seems to me building the navy there at the Ulleungdo makes perfect sense – to check all the hostile parties (Chinese, Japanese, North Koreans), all at once.
10:00 pm on September 30th, 2011 28
Tom will be disappointed but I know, yes I know, when the JSDF’s do a large scale exercise, for instance Yamasakura, the Chinese are always the intended aggressors. The only time the Koreans are even considered is in the aftermath of the scenario when the Chicoms run down the peninsula. All to get at Japan. Korea barley qualifies as an afterthought. That’s but one reason I find the Dokdo nonsense laughable.
7:23 am on October 1st, 2011 29
#28, don’t worry that’s what the USFK is there for, to die.
7:28 am on October 1st, 2011 30
70,000 Chinese are expected to be in Korea over this weekend. Seventy thousand Chinese tourists to help the Korean economy. The numbers of Chinese tourists to Korea are rapidly growing every year, as Korea approaches the 10 million tourists per year mark. This is all good for peace and prosperity in Asia.
What about the Americans in Korea, what are they doing this year, other than the usual bagging on Korea?
7:38 am on October 1st, 2011 31
There’s nothing more exciting for Americans to see Asians fighting other Asians. This is why Americans here are supporting the Jeju naval base so that American ships can dock there to threaten China. Why do Americans view China as a threat but not Japan? Because Americans are scared of China’s economic rise and don’t want to lose the American empire, er I mean, influence in Asia.
Japan on the other hand, is on a steady decline so America doesn’t care about them.
Americans don’t like the Ulleungdo plan because there won’t be any American ships stationed there. It makes perfect sense to me.
8:28 am on October 1st, 2011 32
Glans, do you want to explain to me again how Tom isn’t a bigot?
9:27 am on October 1st, 2011 33
Americans don’t like the Ulleungdo plan because they STRONGLY love and prefer Japan to SK, and have about 50,000 troops based in their beloved Japan. To what Tom says, the U.S. loves Japan because Japan is its de facto colony and its 51st state – there’s nothing Japan can do to get rid of the U.S. military there, as demonstrated by the whole Okinawa Marine base debacle. I think it’s time for Koreans to realize that the U.S. is not really their ally, only cares about preserving its influence and hegemony in the Asia-Pacific region, and has no interest in resolving the North Korea issue because it is to their benefit to see the existence of North Korea. Otherwise, their widespread presence in Asia could ONLY be justified with the China threat, creating an awkward confrontation between these two big powers. It’s better for the U.S. troops to leave SK completely (which they would presumably do so with shouts of Hallelujah and champagne since they have been complaining non-stop about being present in SK), and SK to cozy up to China, the only country that really matters and has influence over NK. Forget about reunification with NK; it’ll never happen. Forget about Japan, which really is irrelevant to SK (you have to pick and choose your fights, and they’re not worth anyone’s time) and has been declining in political and economic influence steadily.
1:52 pm on October 1st, 2011 34
USinKorea asks me to explain to him “again” how Tom isn’t a bigot. I’ve never explained that in the first place, so I can’t explain it “again”. The next question might be, why have I never explained it? Because he is a bigot! That doesn’t mean I don’t like him. I do like him, I’m glad he comments here, I’m curious about his point of view. I keep hoping he’ll tell me what South Korea should do about North Korea.
5:47 pm on October 1st, 2011 35
#34,
His point of view? He’s probably no more Korean than he is likely to be a space alien.
5:48 pm on October 1st, 2011 36
“There’s nothing more exciting for Americans to see Asians fighting other Asians.”
Duh! Asians fighting each other in bikini’s is hot. So what’s your problem?
8:42 pm on October 1st, 2011 37
“There’s nothing more exciting for Americans to see Asians fighting other Asians.”
Yes there is.
MIDGET Asians fighting other Asians.
NOT SAFE FOR WORK
http://az7t8.com/nudevector/t/113/870/8.jpg
9:40 pm on October 1st, 2011 38
That was good, ChickenHead. 403 forbidden.
10:10 pm on October 1st, 2011 39
Hmmm…
Maybe they just don’t want YOU to go there and see the Forbidden Knowledge.
This is the second time you were not able to access one of my NSFW links.
Very curious.
I simply went to Google and typed “asian midget topless wrestling” and chose a good representative picture.
I just did it again and the picture is still there and accessible.
Does your wife have a secret Net Nanny-type program installed so she doesn’t have to catch you looking at smut again?
2:00 am on October 2nd, 2011 40
I reckon asian midget topless wrestlers like chickenheads but they don’t like glandes. And I’m ok with that.
7:46 am on October 2nd, 2011 41
No matter what you Korea haters say, It’s wise for Koreans to protect what is Korean territory, especially when the Japanese do these kinds of dirty tactics, buying up international influence by buying judge positions at international court, which could be used by Japan to wrestle away the island.
Japan buys their way to judge position at International maritime court. This is not the first time they have done this, and not the last.
http://news.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2011/10/02/2011100200495.html?news_Head1
How Japan buys their international influence, with money.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/law/2010/sep/08/law-international-court-justice-legal
1:34 pm on October 2nd, 2011 42
Tom, DPRK occupies half of Korea’s territory. What should Koreans do about that?
7:15 pm on October 2nd, 2011 43
Tom writes:
#20. Just put it this way LaPorte but I’d rather put up with Japanese militarism than American whinings on “ungrateful Koreans”.
Comfort women……..